Mikes Very Own 169 Refurbish

[mfrade]

Hi'Ya Kraig! and then today I go to start the ....thing.. and it goes back to being a ...turd! roll 3 times and then the cylinder would fire and bring any momentum to a stop. repeatedly!

To attempt at retarding the timing, I reset the points at .020, seems to help but the real test will be in the morning.

I wanted to swap the 73 over to the winter setup and wouldn't you know it.. that one won't crank/start. Easy fix, swapped in my spare SG and all's good. Got the blade on and put on the wheels with the dual weights and chains.

 

[mhomrighausen]

That is discouraging!!! Plain and simple.

 

[mfrade]

You said it Buddy! I've owned the 73 since "88" and can count on one hand the number of times it hasn't started.

This morning I want to test start the 169 and finish the wiring and lights. I'm thinking now that if the 16 won't start then the tab on the cam will need a "tweaking".

 

[hydroharry]

Mike - I suspect you're correct? Sure sounds like it's got to be something with that compression release on the cam. Remember to build up your patience before jumping into it. All hammers must be located at least 10 feet away.

 

[mfrade]

Hello Harry. As I suspected, it didn't want to crank fast enough to start. It rolls maybe 3 or 4 full rev's and then fires the cylinder and that brings it to a standstill. Then it begins again, you get 3 or 4 rev's the cylinder fires and that stops her in the tracks.

I jumped it and with the second battery, you can keep rolling it over long enough to get it to catch and fire off.

But I noticed that once it's been run and came up to temperature, it's re-start is no big deal. So I'm curious if it's the hydro holding it back.

But even if it is.. this isn't ideal. I have no desire to plug in a heater an hour before I want to use the tractor!

 

[eford]

Mike do you have a drive out basement?
Guy I know does that with his. Not sure about the exhaust fumes in house though

 

[mfrade]

No, no basement to drive out of.. and the fumes would prevent me from trying it even if I could. The tractors have a shed, un-heated, for storage.

Last year I kept the 73 in the garage with the cars, but it makes it awkward to move around the cars to get into the house. The 73 w/blade is tiny compared to the 169 w/snow thrower. So that won't work.

So it seems I have a fair weather tractor.. as "they" say, it is what it is. I'm not going to dis-assemble everything to get the cam out to do a tweak of the lever. Not right now anyway.

I guess like many others who have these mine will have to go on life support, that is a battery tender and then a magnetic heater for the hydro.

I'll have to admit, this is my first hydro and so far I see nothing to be impressed about! OH, I did get the final wiring parts sorted and connected, so the lights front and rear now work. I had to go so far as removing and dis-assembling the headlight switch! Like the rest of this unit there was rust and corrosion everywhere.

 

[eford]

Well Mike your not alone on battery tender and hydro heater. My dad has a battery charger on the 1450 when he starts it below 30 degrees. Has it on 12 amp setting and no problems starting then. He told me he wanted all the boost he could get, charger has only 2/12 amp settings, I don't think it really needs that, but... He doesn't want to mess with the hydro heater and hasn't needed it yet. My 100 starts fine, no battery help, with clutch in. I have thought about putting a clutch on a hydro just for that reason, but too many things could go wrong. (Don't tell Hydro Harry!)

Oh, and apparently he doesn't run tractor in house, pushes it inside/outside before running. I guess that's fine. I won't mention what it is

 

[mfrade]

Yeah Earl.. my 73 lights right off with barely a full revolution I swear. And I am always amazed what that little rig can push around when the snow flys.

I'm hopeful that there is some of these hydros that don't have to be "plugged in' to be able to start and run, as that is what I need and want. A fair weather tractor won't make me to excited to keep around.

 

[hydroharry]

Mike - if the Hydros were fair weather tractors there wouldn't be any in the mid-west. I swear it has to be the compression release on your cam is not working correctly.

 

[mfrade]

With so many folks sayin' they plug'em in so they'll start. That's not a good sign to me. I'm not so sure about the compression release as it starts just fine once it's been run. And since I don't have the original specs on the compression release, I cannot measure anything to compare what I have and what it was originally.

 

[eford]

Would an AQS engine have the same as your 169? If so I have a k341AQS sitting in my garage, just need to know how to measure it if it can be. Engine has compression, bought it stand alone not knowing what it came from. Does have compression when I turned it by hand. Let me know if that could help.

 

[mfrade]

Thanks so much for the offer Earl! But there must be a reason for this and I'll find it (eventually). We know it is in the compression release, but is it in the spring or the lever?

For this winter it'll likely sit as I have other work lined up. But maybe over next summer we'll pull it apart. I had read in the manual how it is "supposed" to work. So we'll see what happens when the time comes..

For now, MERRY CHRISTMAS to all!

 

[dcalkins]

Mike F i went through this once ,the spring can be a problem ,.so remove the cam cover ,remove the spark plug ,and i would drop the drive shaft ,now roll the engine over till you see the spring .be sure the spring is hooked on both arms of the cam ,now roll the engine back and forth to be sure the spring is where is should be ,if youhear a click one or both arms are free .now if the spring is on right ,i would go to the valve cover ,remove it and check the clearance of the exhaust valve ,if there is to much clearance the valve will be late and not open all the way ,not letting the c/r work right .the exhaust valve should be open as much as .043 .this is controled by a tap on the cam that can be bent up or down ,if the tap is down to far is will not open as needed .yoy never said how long this has been going on ,if it just started i dont think it is the tab ,so its back to the spring ?som is the drive shaft real hard to rotate ? by hand and ios the exhaust sticking ,be sure its free ,this would be a problem ,was the cam ever out out of the engine that you know of ,hope this might help ,but cold weather is a bit of a problem for starting hydros

 

[dcalkins]

Mike F a couple more things ,has the head had been milled .i have removed .050 fron them and still been able to start the engine ,so the only way to check the lift of the cam is to remove the head and check the lift for .043 with a dial .and no i dont think the exhaust lobe is bad on your cam ,it has little to do with the lift on the valve hits 600 rpm

 

[mfrade]

Merry Christmas David. I don't have any real history with this tractor. I bought it and drove it around once for 5 minutes and it smoked some so I tore it apart. I did mill the head .025, and after we spoke last time I replaced the cam spring with a new one. Other than that it's all new inside. The cam to valve gaps were just set and the spark was done at the same time, but in an attempt to retard spark timing I reset the points to .020. , it doesn't help the cold start but does seem to make the warm restart much better.

My manual says the tab is not to be bent as the lever is hardened and will break but I have heard of them being bent "some"... When I have the time I figured I'd pull the head and set an indicator on the valve and check the lift of the comp relief. But I'm wondering if the hydro is the problem for the cold start.?.?.?

 

[dcalkins]

Mike F .the cam can be a problem .do you know what fluid is in it .and can you turn the drive shaft by hand .will it move allright when running ,is the [PTO] belt to tight ,did you double check the spring on the c/r .,and one more thing ,i had the brake on a 125 that was sticking to the disc ,and made things very hard to turn the hydro .thats all i can think of now .so lets say you place a heather under hydro just to see if that may help ,worth a try ,hope this helps

 

[dcalkins]

Mike F one more thing ,did you do a compression check on the engine ,when i had the problem with my 125 ,i had the drive shaft off ,and the compression was at [125] and that was with .050 off the head ,and thats what told me the c/r was not working and the exhaust valve was still down on the seat .and are you sure the head was milled .025

 

[mfrade]

I hadn't noticed all the questions Dave.. Let's see if I can answer some. The fluid is new Universal tractor fluid. I believe I can turn the drive shaft by hand, it does move all right when running, No the [PTO] belt isn't to tight , I just replaced with new the spring on the c/r... I just may have to place a heater under hydro just to see if that may help. But then I'll have to run electric out to the shed!

But then there was more questions.. LOL.. No, no compression check. And yes, I milled the head myself, the head was milled .025....

 

[mfrade]

So we get 16 inches of new snow overnight and like a schoolboy with a new toy I gotta get out there and see if the ol'girl can do some work.

Well of course it won't start.. nah.. that would make life to easy!

So I jump it and crank it for another 15 minutes or so.. and it finally lights off!

so after all that we get out there and the 42A works quite good, I'm starting to smile again.. then I realize "it" isn't just right, it seems to be losing rpms and then it seems to be revving way to much??? I start to head back to the barn and then the pto belt starts smoking!

I can see the driveshaft to the thrower won't turn and then I notice the governor linkage and spring hanging!!

I shut it down, and hoof it back to the shop. Grab some tools and then hoof it back to the tractor where I kneel down in the snow to re-assemble the governor. Get it re-started (whew) and get it back into the barn for the night.

Gave up using the toys and got out the Cat loader to finish the cleanup. Used the 73 to do some mop up and now I've called it a night. I couldn't talk the wife into snapping pics and I wasn't in the mood!