Archive through June 27, 2014

[sblunier]

Once again....

Do not set RPM's "by ear". Get a cheap tach of some variety and do it right.

(Wether Harry is right or not, or wether it was set with a tach or not.....the general population of the site needs to realize that "by ear" does not work for setting RPM.......TOOOOOOOO many variables, and too much risk..........not pointing any fingers or passing judgement on Harry or Jeremiah.............)

 

[hydroharry]

Steve B - ya, I should'a never thrown out numbers for the rpm's I thought I was hearing. I mostly wanted Jeremiah to know I thought both the idle and full throttle were really high - AND the full throttle is scary at least to me.
I sure hope Jeremiah has a tach to check them. I fully agree, even a cheap tach is better than no tach, and AWHOLE lot better than an ear tach.

 

[snicklas]

I absolutely agree with Steve on setting the WOT RPM with a meter!!!!

I bought a 1650 earlier this year, although it is a low hour unit, does not mean it has not been messed with. The first time I had it running, after it warmed up a bit, I opened the throttle to WOT on the dash. It did not level off before I pulled the throttle back. It was WAY too fast. I used it a couple of times before Dad was able to bring over his laser tach and check it. I have no idea what WOT on the dash was, but it had to be above 4000 RPM. I would set it by sound, and have been around them long enough and was at about 3500 according to the tach where I had been using it, so all good. We found the springs on the throttle assembly had been moved. We relocated the to the 3rd hole / 3rd hole and now WOT on the dash is about 3450-3500. For me that is plenty fast enough to run that 16 at. I hope no one before me ran it long with the previous setting. All I know it was scary fast... reminded me of a "Screamin Jimmy".... scared the you-know-what outta me it was running so fast......

 

[dfrisk]

I wonder if Kraig can find the pic that was posted here years ago where a flywheel EXPLODED in the frame of a NF I think it was... the cast iron flywheels on these old K-series Kohlers are all getting 30+, some 40+ yrs old... if you care about your feet at all... 4000 no load RPM is Plenty fast, me, I set mine 3400-3500 WITH a laser tach.

When I got the rebuilt K241 together a year ago... just like Scott, it was still accelerating hard above 4000 RPM... We did some adjusting plus bought a Tiny Tach for that tractor,

 

[jstorma]

I might be looking at a 582 and since I haven't owned a gear drive or drove one before, I was wondering what I should look for clutch/drive shaft and transmission wise. Everything else is like my 782 except for the manual lift.

From following the forum I know there are known to be problems with something wearing on the gear shift and the shifting forks. There might also be problems with popping out of gear under load. I also remember teaser springs being lost on the drive clutch. The owner also told me that when the electric pto clutch is engaged it kills the motor. I would think this would be a switch problem.

I'm hoping to learn a little more so if I'm able to look at this I might know if there will be any problems or issues to check. I'll keep the forum posted on my findings if I am able to look at it.

 

[hydroharry]

Jim S - I don't wanna get into the gear drive problems. There are plenty of Gear Heads on here (where ya at Tom H) to respond to your questions.
As for the electric clutch - if it kills the engine upon engaging the switch I don't think that would be the switch. I'm thinking it's more likely the field coil or something not allowing the clutch to engage. Seems to me if it was the switch it would take out the fuse first (but I've been known to be wrong and hate to admit it).

Scott and Dennis - yup, there is something about these old Kohler K's running at 4k and above that just sounds to me like they're gonna come apart. I know an ear ain't no good for setting the rpm's but ears do seem to know if they are close to or above 4k - which is scary.

 

[hydroharry]

Jeremiah and Jeff - the can on my non-original non-correct replacement, noise suppression 169 muffler is 13 1/2" long (including the rounded-over section toward the outlet end) and it has a 4 1/2" diameter, and the outlet pipe is 4 3/4" long.

Jeff - can you re-check your length measurement and also your diameter?

Jeremiah - can you post your OEM 10-14hp noise suppression muffler dimensions?

I'd like to know what we've all got here.
Thanks,

 

[thoffman]

Jim "S",
First off I hope you're talking about a 582 and <u>not</u> a 582 "Special". The Special are the cheap version of the 582 with the belt driven Peerless trans.

On the 582 I would look for side play in the clutch lever, make sure the 3 holes on the clutch disc are not all chewed up and no bends in the drive shaft. The transmission on the 582 is pretty much bullet proof, but a check on the oil and make sure all the gears work with now clicking sounds.

The IH 582 is a pretty nice tractor. I had one once, but I got tired of the constant (to me) adjustment to the carburetor.

 

[sblunier]

A Kohler engine builder who I trust always said, never over 3800 on a CI flywheel.......but make sure you get a full 3600 out of them if you want the power.

I set all of mine on the strong side of 3600 no load, but never over 3700 no load.

I've seen a lot of them set "really hot" by ear that only tach out at 3000, yet I've also seen 4000+......and didn't want to be near it either!!!!

Vibra tach, laser tach, Tiny Tach, they are all cheap and effective, especially the first two.

 

[sblunier]

582's

I've owned 2 now, sold the first one and missed it, so I bought another one.

All of the standard IH 3 speed stuff applies. Good news is, they are usually "new" enough that the gear boxes aren't beat to heck from years of mowing and shuttle shifting like the early 100's and 122's.

They will have 17T second gears...a bit slow for the power available IMHO...the 16hp will easily hack a 44" deck with a 19T second and 19T is a perfect plowing gear for the 16hp Briggs.

Shift forks aren't really an issue that you have to "go looking for"...if they are bent or really sloppy you'll know it, and the fix is easy. Shift lever repairs are also easy with a little welding and grinding.

Clutches are about the same as all of the other gear drives and wear on the shaft and T/O bearing, etc.

16hp Briggs is a surprisingly strong performer, a little lean at WOT in the fixed jet models, but make good power once warmed up. Carb rebuilds can be a bit of a pain with the vacuum fuel pump (tiny little springs and thin diaphragms). V/R is known to go bad, but is an easy fix.

Great little rides...just wish they had hyd. lift!!!

A SGT 582/1806 on a long frame with 26" rubber, live hyd. lift and P/S would be a mean machine with a 17T second (26" rubber)....or 19T second with 20+hp!!!!!!!!