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Archive through June 03, 2010

IH Cub Cadet Forum

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Bob P., I add Marvel Mystery Oil, aka MMO, to my gas. In addition to acting as a fuel stabilizer it also helps prevent and or reduce carbon deposits. As I've mentioned here before I've been using John Deere Torq-Gard 30 wt oil in my Cub Cadets, actually I use it in all my small engines. One exception is that I used Fleet Farm, Resolute brand 30 wt oil in my Killer Kohler during the break in period.
 
Yesterday I posted concerning the reinstallation of the clutch shaft and "adjusting" the adjusting nut. Matt, Dennnis and KentuckyKen responded and I completed the task. Everything worked fine, but now I have a "squeal" with the engine running. Could I have the adjustment "too" tight ot "too" loose ?
 
Harry,
It's a real pleasure having you back on the Forum, thanks for the kind words on the ZDDP subject.
Many pullers use Cen-Pe-Co oils, from Central Petroleum Co. which is a sponsor of the National Tractor Pullers Assoc. Very good oil and high in zddp too.

Bob,
I don't want to poison a nice Cub Cadet, but as I mentioned the other day, Deere sells a very high quality oil for off road applications. it goes by the name Torq-Gard, is very competitively priced at most dealers and does include a heavy dose of ZDDP. Sorry, I had to say that, as a yeller tractor owner that was once employed by a deere dealer I learned that. Maybe got hired there because my initials are "JD", as Kentucky Ken points out every chance he gets
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Dennis,
True about relative pressure and Kohler valve springs. Still, I've seen damage in as few as 5 hours runtime in factory testing.
Fortunately the lifters in the old K-series were precision ground and finely polished. Very forgiving,overbuilt engines! Is it any wonder why so many are still in service.
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Ken, What else can I say?
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MATT - I wouldn't say running higher than 87 octane gas in a working CC is a waste of money. These little Kohlers being air-cooled run hotter that typical water cooled engines, especially when worked hard like mowing tall grass on hot days. And the fact they have simple carbs with unsophisticated fuel curves means they don't enjoy the automatic fuel/air mixture control of today's EFI car engines with O2 & knock monitoring just makes a conservative tune on the engine more critcal.

The flat head combustion chamber in a Kohler is VERY much not suited to suppressing detonation, has very hot spots, so using a higher octane gasoline which resists detonation can prolong engine life. Pinging and detonation are not really the same thing, but the resulting high cylinder pressures result in the same problems, everything from blown head gaskets, crushed ring lands on pistons, broken rings, burned exh. valves & seats, accelerated rod bearing wear, etc. Rev. Bob even had Ken weld up a Kohler head that burned out between the intake & exh. valve years ago. Maybe Ken or Kraig can post the picture but it looked like someone torched a trench across the sealing surface with an acetylene torch.

Gasoline has to go thru chemical reactions in the cylinder before it "burns", and the octane rating is inversely relative to the speed the gas formulation allows those reactions to take place, higher octane number equals slower reactions which means it "burns" slower and won't detonate as readily.

If your tractor just idles around in parades, then yes, 87 octane will suffice, your not building ANY cyl. pressure or heat. But if your mowing foot tall grass on a 90 deg. day things get HOT in a hurry. My Onan burns a gallon/hour mowing, the ten cents/hour extra for a premium non-ethanol blend gas doesn't add up to much by the end of the summer.

I've had MANY conversations with many people about gasoline (I actually prefer diesel engines but....) Wyatt Compton, Don Vogt, Dave Kirk to name a few. Maximum engine efficiency is achieved right at the point of detonation for the fuel being burned. We ALL agree on that fact. But the problem is knowing when we're getting CLOSE to that point of detonation and it's effects on expensive engne parts. That's why I run a higher than 87 octane gas. My local Kwik-Trip sells a 91 octane with no ethanol specifically recommended for air cooled engines. And when I run it in higher output engines like my K321 in my CC 72 I blend in 104 octane leaded race gas.

Here's another good website with gasoline info, I printed the WHOLE thing off several years ago, explains a LOT about what gasoline actually is and does. http://www.faqs.org/faqs/autos/gasoline-faq/part1/

The links to parts 2 thru 4 are at the bottom.
 
The other day someone asked about the roller bearings and grease seals in the mower spindles. Here's some part numbers if you have the cast aluminum spindle housing (which is the alternate to the ST-745 spindle bearing with stamped steel housing/cup/cap):
Timken LM11910 tapered roller bearing ($10)
Timken LM11949 bearing cup ($5)
SKF 12386 grease/oil seal ($6)

All can be ordered over-the-phone from Motion Industries.

To seat the bearing cup inside the aluminum housing, the $15 GreatNeck 32mm axle nut 1/2" drive socket (part 33625204) from AutoZone fits perfect.
 
Bob N's blown head (gasket):
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The head from Bob N's Kohler before KENtucky's welding repair:

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After KENtucky repaired it:

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Another great gas debate?? As Yogi said "It's d�j� vu all over again".... Uhhhh next on the list is "tire chains, tight or loose", followed by ...........
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<font size="-2">(I still want to know the amount of ZDDP in Rotella T....)</font>
 
Dave R., I was a test engineer for military helicopters in the range of Black Hawk, Jay Hawk, Apache, Cobra, VH60N White Hawk and the VH3D Sea King. All running turboshaft engines but I am also a FAA aircraft mechanic without a lot of piston engine experience.

For the compression test I purchased a Snap On compression gage set (model MT308M) and with the adapter that fit I hooked it up to my shop air and gave it 30 PSI and rotated the engine (Note: the 30 psi will make the piston drive down) with a good strap wrench.

I then removed the valves keepers and springs and staked the valves with a drill. Reassembled with the old head gasket and did the torque on the head. Put the air back to the head with the tappets not in contact with the valves and presto it holds 30 psi for over a hour. Then removed the muffler and inserted a plug in the exhaust port and opened the exhaust valve and have a lot of air (4 PSI per minute) going past the exhaust valve guide in the breather section.

Made a cover for the intake port and rotated the engine until the intake valve was open and put the air back on and had a (1 Psi per minute) leak in to the breather section past the guide.

Ordered the head gasket, valve guides, sparkplug, carburetor bowl gasket and after reading the FAQ in regards to the additives I ordered 5 gallons of MMO.
 
Harry
Eric

There's a rule of thumb of torque per diameter. I'd use that since there's no manual spec.
Yes I have a chart but don't ask me where
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Harry - "How can I find the BG discussion" > What's BG ??? <font color="0000ff">*bushing grease ?*</font>

JD - It's better than JB ! and I burn him every chance I get.

Jerry B - Come in and stick up for yoself cause I wont
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Kraig - Why did you post a pic of da Rev on a Cub then show that head ? That head smelled of deere crap when I opened the box so I asked him what it was off of ... a deere !!
That head was warped badddddd !
A while back when a little "how to flatten" a head came up I never did get my two pennies in there. I use plate glass like many (cause I don't have a surface plate) but I use masking tape down 2 opposing sides of the sandpaper to hold it in place.
 
Round 2

Lucas - Did you ever find that info 'cause Charlie only answered half of your question.

Now you know what PAR means but do you know what the numbers mean ?
 

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