Denny's <B><FONT COLOR="ff0000">I</FONT><FONT COLOR="000000">H</FONT></B> Ramblings...

[kweaver]

Dennis - I'm gonna scratch in yer sandbox

I use to have a '62 R190 5spd 2spd rear that topped out about 45mph. About the last year I've had a hankerin' for it back but I'm sure it's gone to the scrap heap by now , not seen it in 17 years.
I've been thinking how cool it'd be to have it fixed up with modern power steering and a big block Chevy or DuraMax and Chevy running gears / steering / suspension ... basicaly just keep the IH frame and cab. I liked the style of that cab.
What I'd do with it is use it just to pull my boat 20.10 miles round trip , and maybe take it to town for looks and stares.
The old stuff of any kind is hard to find here now , the crusher has ate about everything !!

If I could talk a friend of mine into selling me his B Mack ...

Found an online pic

 

[kweaver]

Dennis - Here's a 549 cid

 

[dfrisk]

KEN - Back when I was a Kid there were about five trucking companies of one kind or another within 12 miles of our farm that all ran only IH trucks. Dad drove for several of them at one time or another. Anything from livestock trucking co's to regional freight carriers for all the manufacturing shops in Moline & Rock Island, IL. One's still in business using pretty new red IH tractors to delivery green farm equipment and blue elevators & escalators

I spent anywhere from 25 to 50 Sunday's a year riding "Shotgun" with Dad going to the Chicago Stockyards from the time I was about 5-6 yrs old till I was in HS. And all but a few of those trips were in IHC trucks, and those other trips were in GMC's. Most of the trucking co's used CO-190's, similar to what Stacy David's working on. IH made some awesome in-line 6 cyl. engines, 401, 451, & 501 CID, Guy Dad drove for most liked the 451's, 5+2 transmissions, they'd run 60 empty, 50-55 loaded some nights. Problem with the CO-190's was the terrible shift linkage back to the 5-speed, about three u-joints and a slip coupling or two, plus all the engine heat & noise right next to you all the time, and in winter all the COLD and noise.

The BIG gas V-6 GMC engines of the early 60's stayed popular with several livestock trucking co's, some old farmer's didn't like their hogs & cattle to breath diesel exhaust. I fondly remember Dad rattling windows in down-town Peoria (Blunier Country) about 1-2 AM one night with a big gas V-6 powered GMC. We ran a "Double" that night, loaded first load of hogs about 6 PM, delivered them to the Peoria Stockyards, ran home, gassed up & loaded second load about 10-11 PM, ran back to Peoria, got home about 4 AM, took a nap and cultivated corn all the next day.

I drove over-the road for a couple years after I was laid-off from FARMALL the last time. Mostly ran a '79 White RoadBoss II w/903 Cum-a-part but also drove some S-2200 IH's, TranStar tiltcabs, etc. Last semi-tractor I drove was a single axle FleetStar 2000 w/478 cid gas V-8 & straight 5-speed. It would run 60-62 mph most nights between Davenport & Des Moines, Ia every night grossing as much as 45,000-50,000#, sometimes 65 with a good tailwind. Most nights got about 3, maybe 3-1/4 mpg if I was loaded light. The little '81 Ford F-700 with 8.2L Detroit 4-stroke diesel V-8 that the Binder replaced was getting around 6 MPG. Now THAT was a nice truck to drive, about like driving an F-150 with air brakes. I did 1000 miles in that truck one day and never left Iowa, delivered or picked up four loads of freight. Still didn't make ANY money!

Until you've had to fuel a gas engine in heavy-duty usage you have NO idea how much more economical a diesel actually is. My typical day with the RoadBoss was 500 miles and over half of them loaded to 70,000-75,000# gross and burn 125-150 gal. of fuel. With that little gas Binder a typical day was 375 miles or so sometimes grossing as little as 25,000# and I still burned 125 gal. of gas.

 

[mhomrighausen]

Just doing some browsing this afternoon when I came across this. McCormick-Deering Tractor Gray Paint or IH Tractor Gray Paint Stock #1063. I remember that my Mom used to say she remembered the McCormick-Deering Series and Regular tractors were slightly different blue/gray than the F Series. Maybe that was from the paints fading somewhat over time or IH using a slightly different formula. My third cousin that started farming with two Regulars said the same thing. I'm 59 now and I started looking for the paint when I was 20. I finally found a paint store in Savanna, Illinois that traced records back to 1936 and that is where I had the gallon minimum mixed to paint my toy Bob Gray (Eldora, Iowa) F30. I was something like 26-7 at the time. There was a gentleman named George Erbe from Monona, Iowa that back in the early 1970s made a scaled down version of the 15-30 and paid a someone at IH to reserach and have mixed the exact color of paint for his tractor. George is now deceased and from what I've heard his son owns the tractor. Some day I need to go find that tractor. (Although I think Rob Dehli is closer to Monona that I am.

We need to plan a Road Trip, Rob.)

 

[thoffman]

on the older Case skidsteers Case used to be that puqk orange and gray, then the orange and brown. I think the grey that was used was/is very, very close to the old IH grey, in fact might have been, after all Case Tennaco did buy out IH. Here's a pic of my '33 F-12 painted that Case-Tennaco-IH-grey.

 

[kmcconaughey]

Denny, this one?

 

[dfrisk]

KRAIG - Yep, That's a Carrot tractor, thought it was a Hydro but it's a GD.

To be honest, I never even saw the 86-series tractors we built. They got out of the plant before I could hunt them up. Not even sure where the paint color broke. I don't remember the 86-series being FWA but they may have been.

 

[mhomrighausen]

Good Morning, All. I'd like to pose a question if I may here. Throughout the past few years I've been immensely blessed in meeting some of the gentlemen "behind the scenes" so-to-speak that worked at the original Sunstrand plant in Rockford, Illinois and were instrumental in the development of such things as the IH hydrostatic propelled combine and tractors as well as the prototype Cub Cadet hydtostatic garden tractor. These gentlemen have tremendous knowledge and I'd like to ask them to share it with others. What I am asking here is this.... How many of you out there would like to see them write articles for say either Red Power or Cub Cadet Connection magazines or even begin posting on this site about their experiences in developing the hydro products? If there is enough support then I will go and ask these gentlemen to please share their knowledge and pass it along to be part of not only their company's history but IH and Cub Cadet history. And no.... I don't just want one or two people speaking up. I also want to hear from those "lurkers" out there. The reason I want to hear from as many as possible I realize that I will be asking of them to take time from their retirement and write of their experience and then submit their articles. I want them to know of how excited we will be to read of their firsthand knowledge of product development in these fields and that it won't be just a coupel of dozen people desiring this. TIA!!!

 

[dross]

Marlin, You are in a unique position, I ask that you not worry so much about how much interest you can get here but what it would mean, overall.
You have access to people I'll never meet, no idea wuo they are. Who, by just going to work, made suggestions or came up with ideas, designed things we deal with sometimes on a daily basis. You have the knolege of who, if you and they are willing and able. My question back to you is why wouldn't you?

 

[wshytle]

Marlin-

I certainly would be all for it. I've done some self educating this past year with the hydro pump and the more I learn the more I want to learn and for sure the more questions I have. It would be a real asset to the site to have known, super qualified personnell at hand. One of the first things you might consider is compile a FAQ dedicated to these pumps we use. After all, as simple as these pumps can appear we all know how complicated they can be once opened. By having a dedicated FAQ the experts wouldn't have to answer repeat questions. I'd hate to bore them.

Great idea and once again, I'm all for it.

 

[mhomrighausen]

Dave R. Yes, I know that I've been blessed and in a way take for granted the fantastic and knowledgeable people that I work with. However.... What some may not realize is to the people, many now retired, what they did was part of their daily work routine and even though it to others is very interesting and important to them it may not seem as such. SSssooo.... If I am going to approach them and ask of them to share their stories about the development of these products then I want them to know upfront that I have a LOT of people that would be extremely interested in reading of their stories. That will help ignite a spark and let them know that I am not trying to be pushy or anything as such. Yesterday, afternoon, I was again blessed to meet the gentleman that lives in Nevada, Iowa and he informed that he ordered the gears for the transmission final drive for that hydro prototype. Again... I was blessed. Yes, I asked if he would be interested in writing somethings for an article.

If only one or two people post then that shows me that they are of the opinion that there isn't that much interest. I remember the interest generated back in 2003 when the Red Power Magazine came out about the Sunstrand prototype hydrostatic propelled Cub Cadet. Ken "The Apostle" Updike had just come out with a book about the FARMALL Cub and Cub Cadet tractors and the questions were brought up about if such a thing existed then why didn't "The Apostle" mention it in his book. I remember having to state that maybe he simply didn't do all of his homework thoroughly enough. I wasn't being mean... just truthful. With this ... I am simply doing my homework... as any good student should do. SSSooooo.... one more time.... Do you people want me to ask of these gentlemen or not? If so then darn it .... POST IT HERE and let me know!!! DON'T just assume that I will simply go ahead if you don't respond. It will only take a couple of minutes for you to post.

Wayne S. While I understand and appreciate what you are asking it is different than what I originally asked. What you'd like to see I feel is somewhat these people as "on-site" advisers and answer questions concerning troubleshooting. That isn't what I was asking. What I am asking is having these gentlemen write of what part they played in the development of the products. To ever have an on-site troubleshooting person will never be. The company already has a setup for people to call or write to ask for technical help.

 

[mgonitzke]

I'd like to see this too!

 

[jchamberlin]

Marlin, I would be interested in the pioneer's response to some of the FAQs we already have posted on this site and Charlie's FAQs. For instance, the deepest most of us want to get into the transmission is to repair the trunnion, but if you chase the trunnion repair FAQ all the way down three levels or so, they start talking about wear inside the transmission. What is their take on this? Was this sort of wear expected? Can it be prevented, or postponed?

On a related topic, I would like to hear some feedback on the proper use and maintenance of the transmission beyond changing the fluid and filter. For example, is there a proper way to shift, or are some customary ways of using the shifter detrimental --like using reverse for a brake. The Stanley steamer was designed to use reverse for a brake, was the hydrostatic? I overshoot each corner on my yard, back up, and re-align for the next pass; would it be better to just slow down and turn? (It seems like it should, but I guess I need a super-steer or zero-turn to actually do it.)

On the other hand, every user on the site could probably pester the experts with questions such as mine the answer to which may boil down to a judgement call or personal preference (trade-offs). Perhaps it would be better if you could "distill" some of the basic issues and have the experts post a few "super-FAQs" that aren't perhaps "Frequently Asked," but are none-the-less revealing because they expose "issues behind the issues."

Did I mention the frequent desire to install a ported charge pump in place of a non-ported pump?

Of course, any STORIES about the development of the hydrostatic concept and implementation would be priceless, and you could assure your contacts of an interested and informed audience (and a few other dunces like myself).

 

[mhomrighausen]

Jeremiah C. What you are asking on the trunion repair and if the wear of the metal was factored into the design/build would be ... yes... an intersting question to pose. Okay... let's see now. The first Cub Cadet hydrostatic propelled garden tractor was marketed in 1967 as the 12hp model 123. IH continued to use the same trunion design up to the sale of the Cub Cadet line to MTD and MTD used the same design if I am correct into the early 1990s. I can't remember when they stopped using the 15U series and went to the BDU21L. That alone tells me a little bit about society/marketing and a throw-away society in general. When someone states, "We now live in a throw-away society.", I think to myself.... "WE'VE ALWAYS LIVED IN SUCH A SOCIETY." Another thing to remember is when manufacturing anything costs must be kept down. To have used a harder steel on the trunion would have then caused earlier wear on other parts of the mechanism rubbing against the harder steel trunion. It is apparent that IH and even MTD was comfortable with the way the trunions wore or they would have changed the design or steel or something to make them last. As for how long should a 15U last is hard to really say. The question should be something to the order of, "How did the previous owner use and take care of the machine?"

Now about using the reverse as a braking mechanism. Would you feel comfortable using reverse on your autmobile as a braking system? Remember my little write-up a couple of weeks ago about the farmer that when his combine's brakes wore out he just used his hydro as a brake/brakeing system. Everything worked fine until the day the engine was idled down too much and died. Now he had a real dilemma.... no brakes almost cost him his life.

Again... I would be asking these gentlemen to write of their experience/help in designing of such thing as the International Hydro farm tractor, IH hydro combine, and the hydro Cub Cadet. I <u>WILL NOT</u> ask them to become troubleshooters on this or any other site.

<font size="-2">Why did I even bother to ask this?

</font>

 

[jchamberlin]

Marlin, I didn't mean to cause you any pain. I guess on this site we just naturally tend toward the trouble-shooting mode. The experience of "trouble" is what draws most people to this site. --Just My Honest Opinion--

 

[kmcconaughey]

Marlin, I'd like to read about the development of the hydro. So please count me as a yes.

 

[kweaver]

Sign me up !
I like R&D and the theories and workings behind the scenes.

Marlin - Seems like I read once that the 15U had a 500 hour life expectancy ?
At any rate they sure over built them !

 

[mhomrighausen]

I'm going to bed shortly. I appreciate the words of encouragement. I know that Jeremiah didn't mean any harm.

KENtuckyKEN. Around 2004 or 5, I came across a Super Cub Cadet with 3800 actual hours on it. The hydro was never touched. It had an appeared to be OEM style cab, mower deck, 18 hp Kohler, engine, front Sweepster, chains and snowthrower. I would have been buying it from the second owner. Only reason he bought it from the first owner was the first owner was his brother and to help settle the estate. He didn't need it and offered it to me for $1000.00 cash. I believe it was an 1872.

Life expectancy of a 15U under normal usage is around 4,000 hours if I recall correctly. And that can go even higher if one performs a little bit more than just normal regular maintenance and uses a good brand of fluid. I.E. Change the fluid and filter sooner than recommended. Yes, the IH designed trunion isn't the best design. Sunstrand offered the design that is on the prototype hydro to IH. IH engineers said they had their own design in mind. John Deere went on to use the Sunstrand designed trunion.

 

[mschutz]

Marlin, count me in. Always interested in learning something new.

 

[ewells]

Marlin that sounds like a great idea.I do not have a hydro but would welcome reading of its development and history