Archive through October 12, 2012

[bwittman]

I would like to know two things about these hour meters. First, how does one read the three-hand meter? and Second, is there any way to refurbish the glass or plastic, whatever it is cover that protects them and make it possible for us to read them ??


The only things that should be green and yellow are the NDSU Bison. GO Bison!

 

[hydroharry]

Jeff B - looks like you're catching up. I'm not sure about the engineers "leaving" a hole in the frame. I suspect they had it put there. And the drain on a gear drive is fairly well know. The bigger problem is why didn't they put one on a hydro?

Brian - answers,
1 - carefully (check Charlie's FAQ no. 13), and
2 - yes, try soap and water, watch crystal polish, and believe it or not BRASSO.

 

[stanner]

 

[dschwandt]

Biggest problem w/the gear wrenches is they'll scratch the heck out of painted/polished surfaces and lots of times the head is too big to fit in where you need to get it on the bolt/nut.
I have a set of 'em but don't get much use outta them because of that. Learned the hard way on my brand new $8,000 APU for my last Kenworth that I had custom painted to match the truck and thought polished S/S bolts would look good to hold the cover shroud on with.
I think the ones w/the swivel head really suck when you need to apply a little pressure to hold it in the right angled plane to keep it on the bolt/nut, they just want to fold up and tip off. They need more resistance in the pivot area.
So much for product R&D!!

Dave S.

 

[kide]

Jeremiah:
You mean like the 1/2" box open Craftsman with the 37.375 degree bend in the middle of the shank so I could get on the head of the bolts on the rear shocks of a '68 Chevelle Nomad station wagon? Yeah, guilty of that also. Maybe you don't break as many as you made it sound... I get a kick out of making tools for the job - like a strap wrench to hold flywheels on small engines while pulling the nut off the drive end (or building a Cub powered well drilling rig)..

 

[jbaker]

Harry I guess I am a slow observer (not learner) I had never seen or known of them two tidbits,

But yes WHY didn't they give us a drain plug on the hydro????

 

[jchamberlin]

Jeff: I got a minute, if I can lay my hands on that hour meter, I'll see if I can't open it up. The lens on mine was hard to see through, since the former owner had painted it black . . .."

Harry: The hour meter is put together to be "tamper proof," evidently, for the reasons Charlie posted.

Gerry: I think you meant to address your last post to Jonathan (in the Old Testament, he was a prince and I was a prophet, if that helps). I own Craftsman, Matco, and a few odd MAC and Snap-On tools. My brother got my Dad's S-K collection, but I did find a ratchet in a pawn shop just like the old man's. I share Jonathan's opinion of Sears' ratchets, they're not as good as they used to be (I still have a set of "fine point" ratchets I picked up in the 70's). It seems they have gone to China for most of their stuff, and lately have even gotten away from plating their wrenches --ugh!

 

[stanner]

Hydro Drain plug:
I've aways just loosened the top nut on the pickup tube to the charge pump, then totally loosen the flare nut where the tube meets the case.. Drains fine there, It's just camoflaged....

 

[kmcconaughey]

Gerry's Cub powered well driving rig...

 

[kmcconaughey]

The drain on the gear drive is a hold over from the Farmall Cub. When the rear was recast for the Hydro they left it out for some reason. The Operator's Manuals do not list a time spec for changing the Hy-Tran out on a Hydro just the filter. They do spec how often it should be changed on a gear drive. Perhaps IH never intended the Hy-Tran to be changed out on a Hydro, just topped off???

 

[dfrisk]

DAVID S. - I agree, a Gear Wrench's ratcheting head is bigger that a non-ratcheting box end, and may not fit some places, and all mine are straight G-W's, none of the pivoting head version for me, for exactly the reason you said. I forget which brand it is, maybe another style of G-W, now has a little release that locks the pivot at a selection of angles.... Not going to try them, seems rather chintzy to me. I think lots of the guys designing this stuff have NEVER worked on anything in their life!

My Dad had a 1940's version of the Multi-wrench, LINK It was totally WORTHLESS back then, and unfortunately companies keep "re-inventing" it again about every 20 yrs to suck money from un-knowing people for the worthless thing. I think I have 2-3 of them hidden in the shop from Christmas gift exhanges. I should hunt them up and "Re-Gift them" back to the people who gave them to me!

And working with polished or even nicely painted stuff requires lots of patience. Especially the polished shiny stuff.

GERRY - 37-3/8ths degrees? Or 37 Degrees, 22-1/2 minutes?... Or 37 degrees, 22 minutes and 30 seconds of angle?

The Nomad reminds me of my old '77 Firebird. There was a circle embossed in the stamped steel right frt fender liner where you were supposed to CUT A HOLE to access the heater blower motor and the heater end of the heater hoses. I never had any problems with the heater motor but DID replace the heater hoses so my car had a patched hole in it.

Co-Worker at FARMALL had a mid-70's vintage Chevy Monza with the 262 CID SBC V8... you know, the one that required removing the engine to change ALL eight spark plugs. He had a bunch of miles on it too, due to his 60+ miles a day round trip commute, but a tune-up only required seven spark plugs!

ANYHOW, getting back to Cub Cadets, yes, the GD's had rearend oil drain plugs. but in 31.833333 years I can't say I've EVER removed the one from my #72. I just pull the rear cover like you would a Hydro, then jack the frt up with a floor jack to make sure all the oil drains out. And with a hydro, since the drain plug hole is the location for the suction line to the charge pump, it makes for a consistent service process. The drain plug on GD CC's must be another feature rolled over from the CUB Farmall. Lot easier to access the plug on a CUB being a foot are two off the ground than the 6 six inches it is on a CC.

One thing IH did very well, was design equipment for "Manufacturability", they made things assemble quickly and easily on the shop floor. Unfortunately, that often times didn't translate well into "Servicability" when you needed to access something that was installed early in the assembly process.

 

[jsalatino]

Garry...Now that I think about it,I've got a set of those craftsmen professional long patteren fully polished wrenches ,sae & met. After using them a few times I decided I didnt care for them very much. they are nice cause there a lil beefy & longer,but if your wrenchin on somthing greasy they suck. lol And what hurts is I bought them a lil after when they came out. kinda exspensive at the time. Dont use em very much anymore.And I've got some snap on wrenches ,I dont care for them either,there older but kinda thin.I'm not sure if the few I do have are normal size or if its what they had a while back,if you gotyta put a lil muscle on em they always made my hands hurt from being on the thin side. But the last time I was at sears returning stuff,I noticed they had them black oxide or some kinda black finish tools. They fit star bolts,hex,and slightly rounded bolts,whatever it said,back to the point,I really liked how they felt and fit onto the hardware they had to test on. Not to mention they look pretty good too. Anyone here own any or use them before? If so how you like em? Only been to sears twice in the past year & half and 1 of them times I just ran in real fast to exchange a few things,didnt have time to look around,so I'm not sure how long they been out.they could have been out for 2-3 years and I wouldnt have known. kinda sucks sears dont do catalogues anymore,all online now. I'd rather look at a book then get online somtimes.

 

[jchamberlin]

Jeff, Harry or anyone else interested, the internals of an hour meter look like a clock to me, complete with a 12 volt relay to start it up.

Pictures also posted in Machine Shop section.

I tried to take a shot from every angle, but I'm not satisfied with the shots I took, it doesn't seem to depict the gears very well. I was trying to include a bit of the face in each shot, so that the viewer could keep the orientation in mind, but perhaps that plan didn't work out as well as I had hoped.

Jonathan: My son gave me a set of the multi-purpose wrenches, and (1) they're rusting, and (2) they feel kind of clumsy in my hand --bottom line, I wasn't very impressed. I agree about the Snap-on wrenches, I never liked them either because they cut my hand, but short of getting a set with the handle twisted 90 degrees, I'm not sure what you're going to do. Personally, I like the trick of using two combination wrenches linked together to get more torque on a nut, works nearly every time I've tried it; the only limitation seems to be the condition of the nut and the room to link the wrenches.

Also the screw drivers with the yellow handles and blue rubber cushion grip were made originally by Stanley and were an excellent screw driver --my favorite.

And Jonathan, it "Gerry" not "Garry" but I expect he'll answer to either one.

 

[dschwandt]

Just like the clocks on my old Chrysler 300's (57-60)The 12 volt "kicker" (electro magnet) winds the spring that runs the meter, then when you shut off the tractor the juice is cut off and the reason the meter still runs is because the clock is still wound and won't shut off till the spring winds down and returns the contacts to the closed position. Then when you turn on the key, if'n yer ears are any good, (which mine aren't anymore) you should be able to hear the little electro mangnet "kick start" the clock spring back into action.

If you have a meter that don't work, chances are the contacts on the e-mag are dirty and not making contact. This is a common problem on the old Chrysler clocks as the circuit is "hot" all the time unless you disconnect the battery.

Dave S.

 

[dfrisk]

JONATHAN - My metric combinaion wrenches are the older Craftsman polished Professional series, longer, smooth, easy to keep clean, I like them! Wish I had the SAE set to replace my old Wright's but they still work fine.

SON's SAE combination wrenches are MAC, and similar to S-O they are flat & thin with almost square corners on the beams and also can be painful when loosening or tightening. Think his Metric's are S-O, but I haven't used them since my Onan we worked on was all SAE. The solution is Mechanic's Gloves! Or just wrap a shop towel around the wrench.

Think it's Craftsman that makes a series of combination wrenches where the beams start out flat, then go square towards the box end, then "Twist" 90 degrees so the box end is 90 degrees to the open end. Reason is so the user has a larger flatter area to grip the wrench. But the problem there is the Craftsman wrenches don't have the tight fitting ends the higher end tools have. The open & box ends are "Broached", a very precise machining operation and I fail to see why whoever makes Craftsman wrenches can't hold tighter tolerances, but the twisted handles seem like a nice idea, although I bet they take up more room in a shop chest drawer. Maybe S-O, MAC & others make them too.

I've NEVER done the thing with hooking a box end of a wrench onto the open end of another wrench to get more leverage. I'll tap on the open end with my rubber mallet to loosen the fastener, but hooking those wrenches together is a great way to break the box end of the one wrench or break the one side of the open end jaw off, and possibly get hurt in the process.

As GERRY said, "The RIGHT Tool for EVERY JOB!".

I'm normally not a fan of using cheaters on things either, but last summer when I blasted & repainted the rear rims on my Super H the rim clamp bolts needed to be torqued to 125-150#/ft, so the Craftsman 1/2" ratchet and a 3 ft length of 1-1/2" pipe slipped over the end of it's handle was used. 2-3 fingers was enough force with that much leverage. My bottle jack handle is just the right size to slip over my 3/8" Craftsman ratchet, but that ONLY happens when the 1/2" ratchet won't fit in that place, plus the jack handle is only eight inches long, and used just long enough to loosen a stubborn fastener. Most stuff gets reassembled with Anti-sieze, or Lock-Tight, or at least oil, and I keep my torque wrenches handy for tightening critical fasteners.

Something I find VERY useful are the profession series Craftsman STUBBY series wrenches. I have SAE & Metric, the SAE set is 1/4" to 1 inch, they hang right by the Gear Wrenches, and get used just as often, normally while using the G-W's holding the other end of the bolt. I had them stashed away in a drawer until I made a hanging cabinent about 5 yrs ago, and now they get used a lot!

While were talking about tools.... Anybody have a good secure brand or style of PEG BOARD HOOK to recommend? I tried them 30 yrs ago and for anything used frequently gave up on them, even the style with the little prong sticking out the back. Four yrs ago I actually made a set of stamping dies to FORM a retainer for them that bolts to the peg board to hold them securely to the peg board. The retainers add length to the bottom of the hook, but then so does whatever THING you hang on the hook. You can grab something off the hook and the hook doesn't automatically fall off the board. Making about 150 of those retainers was a Case of Beer job, cutting the stainless steel, deburring, forming, drilling two holes in each clip, but VERY much worth the effort.

 

[jchamberlin]

More shots of the Internals of the Hour Meter.

The mystery of the works deepens, because after I took these shots I applied 12 VDC to the terminals and the solenoid contacts OPENED a bit. It appears that the workings are purely mechanical and that the solenoid seems to "wind" the clock a pre-determined amount.

My movement doesn't work, but I can manipulate the balance wheel enough to get the movement "ticking" a few times before it stops.

I will also post these photos in the same Machine Shop thread and carry the discussion of how the movement functions from there, primarily.

Edit 1: What Dave Schwandt said about the movement is, I believe, an accurate statement.

Edit 2: Note the cracked plastic top plate to which the terminals are attached. If you have a working meter, or want to keep yours working; be careful manipulating the terminals. I suspect that the reason my hour meter doesn't work is because the different "planes" of the movement are not kept in alignment. On the Machine Shop thread you can see where one of the retainers came loose, which doesn't help.

 

[sshaff]

Greetings again, guys. I'm wondering which tiller model(s) will fit my 70, 100, and 123? I know the Model 1 would but I'm not sure about 1A and 2. I'd also like to learn more about sleeve hitch adapters...are the older Brinly models the most coveted? Same for plows? Am I correct in assuming they tend to be more durable than most new ones?

 

[mfrade]

Great Job Jeremiah! Now I gotta stroll over to the Machine Shop and see how this works!

 

[digger]

Steve S.
Any #1 or #2 tiller will fit any Cub.
As far as the sleeve hitch adapters are concerned, I don't think you'll find a better built one than Aaron at xtrememotorworks.com makes.
He's gone to great lengths to improve the design and composition of the material to be better than Brinly items.

Brinly or Ohio Steel plows are the only way to go.

 

[sshaff]

Charlie: Glad to know any IH tiller model will fit my 100... Thanks. I'm guessing the model 1A and model 2 tillers were just updated versions of model 1?? Regarding plows, it seems IH never made one specifically intended for use their cub cadet tractors, but what about the older one- or two-bottom plows made by IH? Might any of those have been compatible for use with a typical cub cadet?