Archive through January 23, 2013

[mgerecke]

Harry-I messed around with the 149 starting issues for a few hours today and accomplished nothing. First I thought the carb was getting clogged because there is not an inline filter. Took the carb apart cleaned it and reset the base settings for the needles and it started, but still hard. Once going, it ran fine.
I decided to check the static timing by Matts way and the "S" was slightly high in the window so I adjusted the point gap to where the line is centered in the window. Also checked it running with the timing light just to verify it. Now it starts even harder.
Also witched the coil out with no success either.It will never start without pulling the choke out cold or hot. The only thing I have not done is check the valve gap withe the feeler gauges. Didn't want to disturb the gasket yet. I am ready to give up...

 

[hydroharry]

Mark G - now giving up is one thing we don't do around here. Having to use the choke to start it whether it's cold or hot is not unusual. You'll definitely have to use it if it's cold. And you may have to if it's hot, it depends on how long you leave it sit. If it's hot and you turn it off then restart it within a minute or two you may not need to choke it but if it's 5-10 minutes or longer you probably will, unless you have a fresh engine, but you'll still have to push it in immediately. It's somewhat knowing and learning what it takes to start your engine (they are all a little finicky, slightly different). One thing you didn't mention is if you are still getting any back-fire? I'm hoping not anymore which is an indication that there has been some improvement.
Also, I'm wondering, since you tore the carb down did you go thru the adjustments again for the high speed and then the low speed? If so, where did you end up? (how many turns from closed?). We have to start with the basic starting components and I think you've got those all right now, meaning battery, spark plug, points, timing, condensor, coil, carb, carb settings. The next item has to be the valve lifters. If they are not set to lift enough I guess that could be the issue. It's not difficult to check and adjust them. Takes a little to get at them, and you will need a feeler gauge, and a breather gasket kit. Not just the 2 gaskets but the full kit that has 2 gaskets, little rubber spacer, and a small square mesh filter. And you need to follow the steps in the service manual to adjust the valve lifters, and also make sure you don't install any breather components upside down when putting it back together. After this if it's still hard to start then I'm open to suggestions from others but I think you'll have to pull the head and have a look. You didn't mention anything before (and I didn't ask) but are you burning any oil, or does your engine smoke during normal operation?

 

[mgerecke]

Harry-my engine is a rebuild 20 over a few years ago, but only has approx. 30 hours on it. Does not smoke purse any oil. I did get some feeler gauges and will tackle that next. Thanks for all your help so far.

 

[jbaker]

Mark My 129 needs the choke pulled on every start up, but runs great once started. The same 129 started yesterday even with 2 degrees f (yes I know thats warm for you Charlie) overnight in a unheated spot of the barn.

 

[bjamison]

Another pic from the 126. As you can see, it has the RARE hood pulley option from IH...

 

[bjamison]

Mark G - I can only speak from personal experience with these garden tractor engines - and that they are ALL different, even of the same engine.

One thing you mentioned is using choke on a cold start. I have to do that with all of my tractor engines, but two of them, a 10 hp Kohler K series engine and a 20 hp Onan engine, don't hardly need the choke to get going on the coldest of starts.

I've got a 14 hp Kohler Magnum that is a cold starter, requiring choke and another 20 hp Onan that only has about 60 hrs on it and it is driving me nuts trying to start cold!

Nice thing about the Cub Cadets is that the fuel tank is higher than the carb, so you've always got a head of fuel at the carb inlet. On my hard to start Onan, I think part of the problem is a sticky needle/seat on the float - keeping gas out of the carb in the first place.

Just a few thoughts. Good luck!

 

[hydroharry]

Mark G - sorry I remember now you said that it only had about 30hrs on it. About the only thing left then is the valve adjustment and with 30 hrs they should be close. Did it stop backfiring now?

 

[tbdavis]

Ok all - how on earth do you get the grills back to FLAT once warped? Speaking of the grills on the 126, 127, etc. Thanks.

 

[jharvey]

Mark
By pulling the choke you're overcoming a lean condition. These old Cubs are famous for the throttle shaft wearing and letting air sneak by. You should check and install the bushing kit if needed. Smear some grease around the shaft for a temporary seal and if it starts easier install the kit.

 

[jbaker]

Jerry, good tip.. I think I will try it on mine.

 

[mmasheris]

Bill maybe the previous owner had some device on the front and ran the lift cable over the pulley?

 

[jsalatino]

Jharvey....hey that is a good idea , I mighty have to try that too on my 104,I'm wondering if itr really would make a difference,its not sloppy , but its not exactly tight either. Think I would even notice?

 

[jharvey]

That's an idea I learned here, for some reason it stuck out as something to check before tearing into the internals of the engine. The sponsors sell the repair kits for a reason. It could be one of the other fuel/air issues though.

 

[hydroharry]

Jerry - hey that's a great idea. Thanks for raising it again. (While I'm at it here, would you mind changing your personal quote to say something like Tractors are Yellr 'N White, or Grass is Green - or maybe even Nines are wild unless you have a Four)

Mark G - We need to know where you ended up with the setting on your carb - how many turns open for the high and low speed needles? With 30 hours on your engine you really shouldn't need to adjust the valves, but I do think you need to check them. Also, based on 30 hours you should only need the 2 gaskets for the cover (inner and outer).
Jerry's comment about air leakage around the throttle shaft, and using some grease to temporarily seal it is a great idea to check and see. These old Kohler (Carter) no. 30 carbs are notorious for the throttle shaft wear allowing way way to much air to get sucked in - which could be why your needles had to be set so far rich - BUT the result is still not correct which could be resulting in your starting problem. Keep us up to date, and don't be givin up now!!!! I think you're getting close.

(under edit - Mark, please check and make sure you have a no. 30 carb.)

 

[bjamison]

Quick question #1 - I know that front blades and perhaps other attachments were specific to narrow frame vs wide frame tractors. What about the creeper gear? Is it wide vs narrow and/or is it model specific, i.e., a creeper from a 122 or 124 would not fit a 126. What about electric lifts?

Quick question #2. Cast iron oil pans. Were they ever offered on the IHCC tractors? Don't plan on using one anytime soon, but sometimes when I see IHCC Kohler K series oil pans listed for sale, they will say "cast iron". All of my engine oil pans are aluminum.

 

[dtanner]

Bill Jamison

<Quick question #1 - I know that front blades and perhaps other attachments were specific to narrow frame vs wide frame tractors. What about the creeper gear? Is it wide vs narrow and/or is it model specific, i.e., a creeper from a 122 or 124 would not fit a 126.>

blades would be the same. Just the sub frame would be different. I think the nf is a two piece bolt on to use a blade and the wf sub frame is one piece that slides over the rock shaft and the quick connect !

and the creeper I think it is only a longer shift handle on the wide frame with a different bend for clearance.

 

[tbdavis]

Donald - have 2 k301s and a k321 and they all have cast iron oil pans .

 

[rrjohnson]

Here's one for you hydro guys. I have a Cub Cadet 125. To lay the groundwork, the hydro seems to operate perfectly. It is strong in forward and reverse. It is topped off with fluid. From the looks of this tractor, I don't think any work has ever been done on it other than routine maintenance. But there is a noise in the hydro and it is not the usual "hydro whine". It is a rhythmic noise (not very loud and hardly noticeable over the exhaust) best described as a dull thump. Thump, thump, thump. The noise is in direct proportion to the engine RPM. The higher the RPM the faster the thump is. It is there whether in neutral or in gear and it is there with the relief valves opened. I pulled the drive shaft and rotated the input shaft by hand and every seventh time around I can feel it bind. The other six revolutions are smooth. In looking at a parts breakdown I can't see what would happen every seventh revolution. The charge pump has seven teeth on it but they would seem to engage every time around. I tested another hydro I have and I can rotate the drive shaft forever without ever feeling anything. Anybody have any suggestions? Something is definitely going on in there and this doesn't seem normal.

 

[dtanner]

Richard R. Johnson

check the drive shaft to see if it is straight . and remove the charge pump and check the pin that goes through the pump shaft . That pin sits in a star gear that produces your pump pressure.Not much more there that it could be

Check the bearings on the main shaft and see if the swash plates pins are not broken. that should cover it .

 

[rrjohnson]

Donald T: Can I take off the cover and inspect and possibly fix the pin in the charge pump without taking out the input shaft? Or do I need to do a complete teardown of the hydro?