Archive through January 23, 2011

[thoffman]

Wasn't there some question about the steering column being black or yellow from the fartory? Here's the answer.

 

[mgwin]

Tom H.,
The steering columns were black or yellow from where???

 

[digger]

Marty G.
The factory.

 

[jchamberlin]

Has anyone out there ever rebuilt a front axle by adding bushings for the Pivot Bolt and Steering Spindles?

 

[dfrisk]

MARTY G. - Company called ROSS, now known as TRW ROSS made all the steering gear boxes for CC's, JD's, and not sure how many other garden tractor mfg's.

RODNEY - Years ago Red Power Mag. had an article about that town, and the mines.

IH also had other company towns for lumber, also had two iron ore ships on the Great Lakes, not sure if they had their own mining operations up in the Hibbing, MN area or not but they owned Wisconsin Steel and several foundries.

IHC was the Text Book example of Vertically Integrated Manufacturing for decades. They bought very little from outside suppliers for many many years. About the only thing they bought was electrical assemblies like starters, generators, tires & wheels. Made their own carbs & magnetos & distributors.

 

[digger]

Jeremiah C.
Depending on which axle your talking about, some already have that setup in them for the steering spindles.

 

[mbounds]

Tom H: I just realized that the steering wheel on that "PUP" prototype is white. I have seen another photo from the right side of the same tractor and that photo also shows a white steering wheel. Surprising - had not noticed that before now. AFAIK, not seen again till the Spirit Of 76 Lawn Tractor.

Myron B

 

[nbartee]

I’ve read very little about IH’s history, making components from womb to tomb. Having a career in manufacturing I find it intriguing. What are the best books that cover this in detail? If you were to sum up their demise, what was it, bad management, unions, competition, all of the above?

 

[dtanner]

Myron Bounds

Looks like in the picture Tom H posted that the tractor was put together and then painted. The rear ends sitting there don`t appear to have paint on them ? I would be interested in knowing what and how they were assembled and when they were painted. Can some answer my question ? Thanks Don T

 

[jchamberlin]

Charlie P --thanks for the photo. I'm working on a 782 SN 714899.

I don't have to tell you that the 782 comes stock with 3/4" bolt. The bolt is worn, but the axle actually rides on the threads, so any replacment will also wear. There is also a good deal of wear in the axle where the spindle "spacers" ride.

If I "upgrade" the axle to the MTD-style, I will raise the front end by an 1" and spend a lot of money doing it. I have too many questions about the Super Steer Upgrade, and I have other things I need to fix on this tractor, so I thought bushing the existing setup would tighten the steering up, which is what I really need right now.

I just wondered if anyone had taken this approach to what I think must be a universal problem on tractors that have seen a lot of service.

 

[dfrisk]

NORM - Not to get too far off topic, but there really isn't one book that best describes the way IH managed their business. There's some great articles in Red Power Magazine every issue about IH history. Several of the suthors have access to the IH Corp. Archives at the WI State Historical Society Bldg in Madison, WI. A search should get you WEEKS of interesting reading. Think Guy Fay said there were four FULL semi-trailer loads of historcal documents & pictures given to the WSHS.

Also joining IHCC, IH Collectors Club, and getting their quarterly news letter, Harvester Highlights, is great too.

The book TOM H posted about, "A Corporate Tragety" by Barbara Marsh is a good start.

To answer your question about IH's demise, I think Door #4 is the best answer, All of the above. IH had a long history of an adversarial relationship with labor unions. I wouldn't say IH's Management was "Bad" (I was part of that management!) but their marketing group always kept forcing them into niche markets with low volume sales but high development costs which tied up design & engineering resources that should have been used to develope newer designs of the things they sold Millions of instead of hundereds of. Marketing also rushed engineering to release not sufficiently proven designs to market which caused recalls and loss of loyal customers. IMHO, post WW II they concentrated on trying to build small tractors, CUB, A/B/C to replace horses, a very small market once all the horses were replaced, and totally MISSED the need for improving and building larger row crop tractors for the midwest. Most of the competition saw this need and were able to get a jump on IH in the late 50's & 60's. FARMALL was building 325 FARMALL M's per DAY in 1950/'51 and in '52 sent parts to LVL to build an additional 50 Super M's plus their own 325/day, plus FARMALL was building H's & Super H's, but by the late 50's all those tractors were too small. IH ended up turning up the engine speed on the 560 Standard tractor and adding planetary reduction units to the ends of the rear axles to create the 660 International to make a five-bottom plow tractor. It wasn't until 1963 with the 806 that IH made a real 5-bottom tractor.

When IH put all their resources to something, great things happened. The FARMALL H/M, Cub Cadets, Axial Flow combines, plateless corn planters, most of their plows & discs, the 806, 1206, almost ALL the 56-series of tractors, most of their bigger trucks & semi-tractors. They just wasted too much time chasing small volume markets with little if any profit potential.

 

[thoffman]

Norm "B",
As Denny stated A Corporate Tragedy By Barbra Marsh tells the story from beginning to end.

Don "T",
It looks like the steering column is in place when painting the final coat as seen here.

 

[thoffman]

Denny,
I think IH missed out by not making what should have been the "R" tractor. That would have been a row crop tractor with the W-9 engine.

I don't have the info right in front of me but is the "ACTUAL" hp of a Original Kohler 6.60hp rounded to 7hp.? Trying to figure the 660-PUP taging.

 

[nbartee]

Thanks Dennis, appreciate your write-up.

My first experience with IH was owning a ‘72 Travelall. I couldn’t believe how much steel was in that thing, massive! We used it to pull a travel trailer & we pulled it all over the U.S, up & down mountains in Colorado. I replaced the upper A frame bushings once, had a heck of a time. Always told everyone that to work on a Travelall, you had to have a sledgehammer & a torch, but I came away with an appreciation of its ruggability & workmanship.

I’ll look for that book to get started.

 

[dtanner]

Tom Hoffman

Thanks so much for that picture you posted

. My plan for painting my 125 and my Original can go ahead as planned . I was planning on lift up the tractors like that to paint them.I will us a ATV winch and with the over 10' ceiling here I think my idea can no work for certain.I will add a swivel so I can spin the tractor as I paint it,I will be able to lower it as needed.More pictures later will be posted on my 125 refurb.

 

[aaytay]

Wow, those are neat pics..

Ya gotta love the guy in that last pic just posted spraying the frame of an Original (and probably doing it all day long) without a respirator on!

If you scroll down to the pic Tom posted at 8:52pm, you can see what looks like a "paint-booth" in the upper-right hand corner. I guess the guys assembling tractors were getting to smell paint fumes too!

I'm not a real big "OSHA" guy, but at the same time it's pretty scary to think that posting a "No Smoking" (you might BLOW up!) sign is considered appropriate safety for your workers.

 

[aaytay]

Here's a better pic of "assemblers" working side-by-side with paint fumes. Notice the "No Smoking" sign.

 

[aaytay]

Tom-
Could "660" simply be a date code? (June - 1960) It could have been used to signify a (completion) goal by the engineers/builders to keep everybody on task???

<font size="-2">On a side note, notice the cigarette in between the guy's fingers in that "660" picture. Guess there were weren't any "No Smoking" signs in that dept!</font>

 

[digger]

Jeremiah C.
If you'll check the Parts Look Up above, you will find that the 782 has what you were asking about.

And more than likely, no less than 5 of our sponsors sell those parts.

 

[digger]

Art,
If you'll notice to the right of that No Smoking sign, you will see a Exhaust hood.