Archive through August 31, 2004

[kmcconaughey]

Denny, I was just joking around with you no need to rush them off to get developed or dig them out to send. <font size="-2">unless of course you wish to do so.</font> )

 

[bmoore]

Dennis,
I was serious about the dry sump system. I would think that you could rig external lines passing through the block (thus becoming internal lines) to spray the connecting rod/cylinder/crankshaft, camshaft, valve stems, and bearings, with fairly cool (due to increased volume of oil in the sump) oil on them. Lubrication plus cooling.
If you wanted to go really nuts, you could drill parts and run lines and fittings for forced oiling. A scavenge line from the oil pan to the oil sump canister could even incorporate a cooler, and the sump canister can be whatever size you want.
I would think that a common Chevy oil pump and pickup could be modified to get the correct (whatever that is...) flow volume by milling the same amount off the case and the gears. Should be able to tee something together for scavenge and pressure lines, or just run two pumps off the same drive. Maybe there's some relatively inexpensive pump with two inlets and two outlets, I don't know. Might not be necessary, but it would be neat.

 

[sblunier]

Bruce,

.....and the Chevy oil pump would use all of the extra HP you might gain just to move the oil

 

[dfrisk]

BRUCE - Small gear pump would be easier to belt drive from the crankshaft and that's all the Chevy pump is. Plumbing lines into & out of the crankcase would be easy with fittings from Earl's, etc. Problem with trying to lube the rod bearing is the crankshaft throw on the Kohlers is hollow. About all You could do is aim an oil jet at the rod and have a directed splash lube system. There's been conversations about adding a pump of some sort to circulate oil thru a cooler that I've been part of. It's ALL very "Do-Able" but like Steve says.....not sure there's any advantage to it. I'm kinda working on an engine project that I would like to "Instrument" and monitor head temp, Exh. Gas Temp. & oil temp. on a continuous basis. These old flat head air cooled engines are pretty limited in how much heat & pressure You can build in them and retain any long term durability. It makes a lot of difference whether You want to measure life expectancy in seconds, minutes, hours or Thousands of hours.

 

[dvogt]

John, I'd put the weight lower if you can

things I've seen done to kohlers. Julian Stahl from Midwest Super Cub had a 16 hp that he put a pinto head on with a overhead cam. it was driven with a cog belt off the crank. My brother Jim had a K582 that used a small hyd. pump as a oiol pump. it was cog belt driven off the crank. he also used a distibuter off a small car engine for the ign systom. I know theres a K361 floating around that I'd heard numbers off the dyno to be over 100. I saw a 12 hp kohler with a small blower on it. done nicely but to a stock engine. if you were to go to a dry sump you'ld need to preasurize the oiling systom. so you would need to drill out your crank & cam to feed oil there some how. then you'ld have to probably put a oiler on the rod to squirt oil up to the piston and put some oil to the valves somehow. then you need some scraper to scrape the oil off the crank. a scavenging pump and a PSI pump. now working with a pulling tractor weight is also a concern

 

[bmoore]

Thanks for the comments. This is a great forum for discussing ideas, and wondering "would this work?". I did mention in my post about cutting down the case and gears to decrease the volume of oil flow. I just used a Chevy in my head because of familiarity, ability to be modified, and low cost. Tell me why I'm wrong in this line of thinking: If a common Chevy pump can provide oiling for 8 cylinders-worth of rotating and reciprocating parts, why can't its volume (and the power required to turn it) be reduced by milling the case and gears to provided lubrication for one cylinder? A Chevy pump is also driven off the cam, so its speed is half that of the crank. I know that there are later model single cylinder engines with pressurized oiling, I'm just not familiar with them.
I guess I didn't say, but was thinking of mounting the pump externally, driven off the crank snout, with lines running to and from the crankcase and canister. I also stated "If you wanted to go really nuts," which I often do when I'm daydreaming or scripting nightmares, forcing oil to the parts could be done instead of just providing a spray. The hollow crank throw on a stock crank filling with oil rather than air could present balance problems to be corrected. There would also be orifice sizes to contend with, to get the right amount of oil in the correct places. Since the whole thing started as a way to get oiling to Dave K2's overhead cam/valve proposition, I guess it fit in the daydream category. I was thinking of a way to force oil to the upper end parts, and to provide cooler oil to the lower end. Like I said, "Might not be necessary, but it would be neat."

 

[dkamp]

heehee... look what I started... :-}

You're right, Bruce- I was thinkin' Overhead Valve, with a pushrod-adaption of some sort, but OHC belt-drive would be fine... if you're slick, you could use the back side of the OHC to operate a self-priming scavenging pump/pressure pump assembly.

Making the crank pressure-lube would be tricky- you've got ball-bearings there instead of babbit-inserts, so making it a hydraulic floating bearing (like automotive) would be quite a chore. Making that rod a hydraulic floating wouldnt' be a bad idea, but I think it'd be custom-crankshaft territory... you'd hafta do some drilling magic, as well as find a place to put a slip-ring to force oil up there- ball bearing mains preclude that...

but you could run a focused spray at the bottom, and a light trickle at the top, let the windage splatter the camshaft, and a second nozzle at the bottom of the piston.

But the concept that spurred it, was a memory of the cylinder head on my Honda CX500D motorcycle... it's a pushrod motor, where 2 pushrods operate 2 valves each, for 4-valve per cylinder...

 

[dvogt]

well its getting close. updated pics of the halfpint gearbox project. still have a couple things to do tothe chassis, then the motor has to go in. 10 days left to go. should make it if its test drive goes well

 

[sblunier]

Nice work Don!!!!

 

[rmunday]

Nice Don!