1862 hydraulic leak

[Jay Fetters]

My sweet little 1862 cyclops is starting to get irritating. The power steering line that runs to the hydraulic lift valve in the dash, is leaking, and causing my cyclops to piddle on the floor. I've rubbed her nose in it and swatted her butt, but she continues to piddle on the floor! But seriously though, I've replaced the o-ring 7 times, with zero success. I've even tried to double them, and it just leaked worse. I'm assuming the tube is shot, even though when I removed it for inspection, I found nothing that I could see wrong. Does anyone know of a source for this part? 727-3052? I've searched the sponsors, as well as a couple other places I know of, but can't find this line. I'm thinking I may have to take the valve and line to a machine shop and have a jic fitting installed in the valve and a new line made. But this is a last resort. Attached are photos of the leak and the part diagram.

 

[cubs4lifeofme]

Is it possible to put teflon tape and a little pipe dope on it ?

 

[Jay Fetters]

I'm not sure that would work. It's a tube with a shoulder on it that pushes the o-ring inside the boss on the lift valve. It's hard to describe. I just called the dealer I go through, and they put the word out on cubs dealer network, so hopefully there's one new one still on a shelf somewhere, but I kinda doubt it. I did find a used one, if it comes right down to it, I'll go that route first, then if it still leaks, I'll take it to the machine shop to see what we can do. That's the plan as of now.

 

[mgonitzke]

Is there any visible damage to the valve or line? What are you using for O-rings? Not all are created equal, and not all materials are compatible with petroleum-based oils.

 

[Jay Fetters]

Is there any visible damage to the valve or line? What are you using for O-rings? Not all are created equal, and not all materials are compatible with petroleum-based oils.

The first few were from a kit, maybe harbor freight kit?, but the last 4 were direct from cub. When I was on the phone with my dealer, he told me of a back up o-ring that is used on the 3000 series. He described it as plastic spacer that pushes harder on the o-ring. I got more o-rings ordered, and the back up o-rings as well. I didn't see anything on the valve, I had it completely removed. The line looked OK as well, but it wasn't removed from the machine. This weekend I'm taking it completely off for a more thorough inspection. The way the fluid is coming out, I'm starting to think it's not the o-rings, I'm sorta wondering if the clamp rubbed a pin hole in the shoulder on the line. I'll know for sure probly Saturday, and hopefully it's a bad line.

 

[Jay Fetters]

So here's the line, there is one spot that has a shine to it from the clamp. I shut the lights off and shine a bore light in the line, and no light came out. I'm at a loss on this, I thought for sure I'd find the smoking gun, but not yet. Next step is removing the valve again, for a reinspection. Not sure what else could be done.

 

[mgwin]

How about a slightly thicker O-ring?

 

[jkoenig]

What if the tube is leaking under pressure? You could cut a bicycle innertube, and clamp it on each end of the tube, and pressurize it a bit, and it may tell you if/where it’s leaking. Submerge it if you need to.

 

[Jay Fetters]

So, I finally found time to get back to this pain in butt cyclops. I completely removed the valve, AND... found nothing obvious. I just tried to use the back up oring my dealer told me cub used on the 3000 series. That didn't work either. Part number 721-0492, put in behind the o-ring. What to do... What to do... Here's a picture of the hole that the previously pictured line goes into.

 

[lpalma]

Just checking, backing washer goes on first, then the o ring, then push it in till it is seated with the flare almost flush. Then make sure you have the clamp on the right way.

 

[JD ham]

I worked in the hydraulics industry for a few years and we used this stuff https://www.amazon.com/Vibra-TITE-4...ocphy=9027229&hvtargid=pla-319995742721&psc=1 it’s a thread sealant we used it on instances just Like yours the threads have to be clean and dry. I worked for a Parker hanifin distributor i they had a store front (Parker store) I know our guys could have found you a jic conversion fitting then cut and flare the tube if it’s not metric tube. The thread sealant works good we used it on some random occasions when we had a stubborn fitting that wouldn’t seal.

 

[dgeary]

I blew up the parts diagram. There is a clamp (item 2) that pushes the tube (item 7) into the valve (item 1) to compress the O-ring between the valve seat and the shoulder on the tube. Most likely, you are not getting enough compression to seal. The clamp may be worn or bent and won't push the tube in far enough.
When pushed in as far as possible by hand, the tube shoulder should still be slightly proud of the valve surface. If it is recessed, you will never get the O-ring compressed and therefore won't seal. Spacers between the o-ring and tube shoulder won't allow it to seal as the o-ring needs to be between the valve seat and the tube shoulder to create the seal.
If the tube shoulder is recessed, you could try modifying a machine washer to fit between the shoulder and the clamp. O-rings are designed to be compressed about 3% of the diameter to create a seal, in your case about 0.002" so that is the amount of compression to shoot for or slightly more. Otherwise, check the clamp to make sure that it is pushing the tube into the valve.
BTW, sealer would be useless in this case. And I would only recommend it for a pipe thread fitting.

 

[Jay Fetters]

Lewis, yup, that's exactly how I put it together.
Dgeary, the shoulder of the tube is slightly proud of the valve when it's tightened down. The clamp angle match perfect to the other clamp. There has to be a tiny burr in the hole that I can't see/ feel. Or a small pin hole in the tube that I can't find. Either way, I finally gave in today and talked to the local hydraulic/ machine shop. I'm gonna bring the valve and line to them and let them decide how to fix it.

I did find a line for sale used about a month ago, so I saved the web page. Yesterday I went to order it, and of course they sold it. I contacted Houtz to see if he had one not listed on his web site, and of course I struck out with him as well. So, we'll see what the machine shop comes up with and in a week or two this smooth old girl will be back in action!

 

[greg royal]

Hey Jay,
As I wrote in response to your suggestions, I am thinking it may be easiest to tap the hole and add the appropriate JIC, then have a custom hose made.
I am going down that path, unless we find a compelling reason to do otherwise.
Greg

 

[Jay Fetters]

There is an adapter that goes right in the existing hole, and adapts to #4 jic. The other end, underneath the tractor should be a male jic already. So all you are buying is the adapter and the hose and 2 hose fittings. There is no need to tap threads into the valve, unless you want to.