Zero turn ? what should I buy ?

[dtanner]

I hope this don`t pi$$ Charlie off but I have been asked to mow a 2.5 acre lot at least once or twice a week.Its is a side hill and steep area , The home owner does it now with an 1862 . That scares me . I was thinking of a zero turn , But what or who `s brand should I buy.I could use it on my own lawn and his. I`am thinking on a new machine with a bagger. I would love some input as to what to expect and there faults . Thanks Don T

 

[ewells]

Don I went to Cub dealer and HD Wed and Thurs for the cub test drive challenge and drove both the rzt and rzt-s.The S series has steering wheel and seems to be less touchy when driving and manouvering.In talking to the reps they stated the S is better on slopes.On the S when turn steering all way one drive wheel goes forward and one reverse like zero turn and has a separate peddle for forward and reverse.The rzt-s 50 is 25 hp and rated for up to 3 acres priced at 3199.I dont know if this is any help but just my comments

 

[aschumacher]

Don, get your hands on this months (may) copy of CONSUMER_REPORTS magazine. They have comparisons of various riding mowers. Also comments on zero-turn and other features. <font size="-2">I dont think you can get anything on their website without a subscription, consumerreports.org</font>

 

[digger]

It doesn't make any difference what he gets, he'll just tear it up so he can fix it!

 

[dtanner]

Charlie "Digger" Proctor

Well I don`t have a clue when it comes to zero turn mowers, But I bet some are better than others.

I`am still waiting to see pictures of that wing you bought !

 

[jchamberlin]

Don --I was told that zero turns were not appropriate for yards with ditches, etc. that they needed fairly flat ground to operate. They are at their best mowing around obstacles like trees and bushes. The folks that CAN use them, love them, because they tell me their mowing time is cut in half.

 

[thoffman]

JC, The guy I worked for last summer cut ditchs, hills, slopes, etc., didn't matter. They work well in all applications.

 

[lhinds]

Don from what i hear, if you want the top of the line buy a Dixie Choper. The cub cadets are giving problems with the drive motors. I think mostly on the left side. (acording to my neighbor) He said the dixie would save him time because it cut faster than the others.This guy cuts over anything. Ditches ,slopes.

 

[jchamberlin]

Don After reading the posts below, I could be wrong --who would have thought?

Seriously, I'll have to check my source of information: the counter-man at the local Cub Cadet / Kubota dealer. He told me that he did not own a zero-turn because his yard wasn't suited, but wished that he could. I'll have to ask him specifically why he doesn't think his yard will work with a zero-turn. I thought I remember him saying something about his ditch out front.

I will second what Luther says about the Dixie Chopper --it is the model carried by our local independent lawn mower service shop. 10 years ago they cost $5,000.00, I can only imagine what they're up to now. I was told they were rated for commercial service, definitely not your box-store tractor.

 

[glippert]

Don - I don't know anything about these mowers except what I've seen on TV ads, but I'm intrigued.

http://www.badboymowers.com/

 

[dross]

Jeremia, A friend years ago had an old Yazoo, which I count as an original zero turn. It was a hog on ice anywhere but a flat solid yard. Mabey thats where your guy got his expirience. That yazoo soured my friend for life on zero turns

 

[jchamberlin]

Dave --Thanks for the validation.

Greg --Our local Tractor Supply Company (TSC) carries the Bad Boy line, and they certainly seem heavy-duty. The smallest ones I've seen still have a 50" deck. Mighty beefy, though, especially the larger ones. Definitely in the Commercial Class, and reasonably priced, too.

 

[dgregg]

I have been using a Zero turn for a lot of years now. Started out with a used Dixon with a 50" deck,Cut my mowing time by half over the CC149.
The rigid frame zero turns like the smaller Dixons and usually the cheaper ones are not good on any slope as the frame doesn't flex and you will loose traction and it will turn down hill.
The better mowers that have a pivoting front axle are just as good on a sidehill as any other tractor. While my yard for the most part is flat I do mow some ditches. I can mow one section with my Grasshopper that I would have never tried with the CC149.
Most ZT's are a mid mount mower meaning the deck is under you. I have a front mount which puts the deck out farther in front so it has wheels , the drive wheels are under you and it has tail wheels as well. I like this because I can get the deck under the edges of the pine trees and bushes, but they are dirtier to run.
I like my Grasshopper and it is very heavy built with no stamped steel anything on it, all welded up heavy.
Ferris makes a mower with a suspension that will give you the best ride on any and is supper built as well. I would have bought a new Ferris this last time if I have not ran into a great deal on a used Grasshopper on my way to the dealer.
ZT's are like anything else, there are cheap versions and good versions. I would try to look at several brands and compair how they are made and how well you think they will hold up. Many dealers will let you try one out at there place. hop on one and see how it works.
You get what you pay for I guess. The higher priced ones will outlast the cheaper ones because of their better builds at least that is what I think. The box stores cheaper ones wouldn't last me very long.

 

[eburton]

Mr. Don T.,
I have used ZTs for about 7yrs. First one was a Gravely 2148 (21hp Kohler 48" cut). One I'm using now, and this is the 4th yr., is a Bad Boy Pup series (30hp Kohler and 60" cut). Son is still using the Gravely. Decided to install bar tires on rear of Bad Boy because the turfs would lose traction to easy (lot of hills and ditches). I believe the "Outlaw" series has replaced the "Pup" series. They're designed to be mechanic friendly (Charlie said you would tear it up so you could fix it). 1/4" mower decks are the thickest in the industry. They make a residential and commericial version. I think there's about a $3000 difference between the two. I purchased the commercial version because of the amount of grass I have to mow (bout 4 acres)and I expect it to be the last one I purchase. David G. has good advice on this subject. Don't rush in to it.

 

[kide]

Don:
I'd be very cautious about using a ZTR on sidehills. At the very least ask the dealer to let you take a demo unit and try it where you're actually going to use it. I've used a 48" Scag Tiger Cub, both with and without the clamshell grass collector since '05 and to tell you the truth, I'm always puckered up when mowing the parts of my yard that are sloped. Regardless of what others have said, ZTRs are not ideal for sidehills because the weight is primarily on the two drive wheels, with the front wheels acting as castors. When you get on much of a sidehill, the rear tires will slide sidways and the front wheels will caster. I mowed the same yard for 20+ years with the 129 and with the weight distributed between the front and rear tires, never had a problem with it sliding. ( Why did I change to the Scag? - I had lots of things to mow around, not many big open areas and my creaky old elbows were getting tired of cranking the 129 steering wheel.)

Other comments - I'd never buy anything except a commercial grade unit. Check the thickness of the deck steel, get one built like a tank (the Scag I bought uses 1/4" + plate for the top of the deck). Get a unit with greasable pivot points (lots of zerks). Look at the drive system - if its got the one piece, unitized transaxle, skip it - they're not tough enough - look for separate pumps and hydraulic drive motors with the motor shafts actually the axle stubs. Make sure there's a good filter in the drive system hydraulics, too.

One thing nobody will tell you is that the primary feature of a ZTR, turning on a dime, is its biggest fault also. If your yard is soft, it'll tear it up every place that you do a "zero turn". You end up learning to do "J turns" when you're mowing an area that requires a lot of back and forth.

I'll admit that it's fast - I cut my mowing time in half - but for a hilly lot with lots of trimmimg, if I had to do it over, I'd buy a regular tractor with as tight a turning radius as possible, with power steering if it's available. Heresy for all the ZTR owners, I know,but I've never been real happy with the way the lawn looked with scars all over it. On big,dry, flat lawns like my neighbors (who both bought the same units I've got based on using mine) it's great. I love the way the Scag is put together, and with a hitch on it, it's damn near as useful as the 129 for utility work (park a full size two wheel utility trailer with a ZTR in a tight space once and you'll never want to hook it to a regular tractor again..). We built a hang off the rear bumper sprayer unit for the ZTRs and that works great, too.

Anyways, that's my story and I'm stickin to it...also, as Kraig is fond of saying, YMMV, yadda, yadda, yadda...

BTW - hello from sunny and HOT Florida, where there's no yard to mow (I knock it out in 5 minutes with a weed whacker) and the back roads are quiet and perfect for crusin' the Yammy (except for an occasional armadillo speed bump). I'm staying away from MI until every other snow bird has flown north, then maybe I'll follow.

 

[dross]

Gerry, You know you can stop by anytjme you want? <font size="-2">just sayin</font>

 

[stanner]

Don T,
I'd have to vote for a Ferris.. They're made here in Central NY, and are built like tanks.. A lot of landscape companies use them here, and they let them go after 5 years and buy another one... These used units are great for home owners...

http://www.ferrisindustries.com/

 

[kide]

Dave R:
Just as soon as I get thrown out of the Yamaha and Uniden forums I'll be looking for a place to hang my hat anyways...

Don: After I wrote the book this morning, I remembered that I'd seen a ZTR that had steerable front wheels, taking care of the caster issue that I told you about.. Amazingly enough, when I start looking, its - wait, don't guess....the Cub Cadet Z-Force S. I have no idea how tough the rest of the mower is, but supposedly it works quite a bit better on sidehills...

 

[jchamberlin]

Don T--
Even though David Gregg and Gerry Ide have chimed in with balanced reports of the pros & cons of Zero Turns, I got a chance to catch up with my "source" of information on Zero Turns, the counter man at our local Cub Cadet / Kubota / (and now) Bob-Cat dealer. He is sticking by his story that the ditches in his yard are not conducive to a Zero Turn mower, and is the reason he doesn't own one, even though he could. As evidence of the validity of his position, he pointed to the three (3) Cub Cadet Zero Turns that he had in his shop getting wheel motors replaced.

It seems that the Zero Turn mowers, unless they're built like a Kubota with hydrostatic TRANSMISSIONS at each axle, are subject to the same issues as the old KT17 series I motors: on hills the oil moves away from the parts that need to be lubricated and the hydrostatic MOTORS at each wheel get starved for oil and burn themselves up.

(Note: I think I'm getting my terminology right, I remember the Kubotas had transmissions at each wheel, and the run-of-the-mill ZTR had something less. The Kubotas, though, are definitely in the "commercial" territory price-wise.)

On an additional note, he pointed out to me that the motors never work at EXACTLY the same speed, so that one handle is always going to be 1/2" or so forward or backward of the other --they're never exactly even (except the Kubota).

Anyway, from all that I can tell, Zero Turns are great mowers, but they're not perfect: you have to "pick your poison."

Personally, if I had to mow hilly ground, I would be rather skittish about them.

 

[ljones]

We have had a Scag wildcat for a few years now. We have mostly hilly ground and it does fine. It now has 527 hours on it and we have done nothing but routine mantenance.