Ross steering rebuild

[John DeBree]

I just finished buttoning up the Ross steering for my Model 70. New bearings, new stud, thrust ball bearing on the pivot, and fresh grease. A couple things- I have the stud backed off almost all the way- I guess when they're new, that's to be expected? The worm looked like new when I got it cleaned up, but the old stud was pretty worn. Secondly, it's tightest in the middle of the travel, and has a tiny bit of play out at the ends. That's exactly the opposite of what I would have expected. Seems to me the steering would spend more time in the middle. Anyone know what color the steering gear was from the factory? Mine is mostly yellow, but black up near the top. I have another one that is all black. Maybe black was the color Ross painted them before shipping them to IH? Just curious which is correct, although this will be far from a true restoration.

 

[kmcconaughey]

John, hmmm, I would expect the same with the steering gear, looser in the middle and tight at the ends. It's been ages since I've messed with any of mine...

I believe that the steering column was installed into the chassis before painting so the lower portion was painted yellow. The pedestal was painted separately and added later so the top of the steering was left black where it protrudes through the dash. With the Original, the entire steering column was painted yellow.

 

[hydroharry]

John - it's hard to understand your situation based on your terminology. My only suggestion would be to use the Service Manual, which has a good section addressing re-assembly while the column is on your bench. That's the best way to test operation once completed.

 

[John DeBree]

It's fine; I just thought it odd that it would be tighter in the middle. There is no orientation to the stud/follower- it's round. I've seen plenty of them with flats worn on them, but they start out round.

 

[dschwandt]

round and tapered to fit the worm gear.
Did you get a new follower or rework the old one?

 

[John DeBree]

I bought a new one, along with new ball bearings. Too cheap to be worth messing around with the old one. I did rework an old one as a spare.

 

[hydroharry]

John - is you new cam follower stud the same length as your old one. There are 2 versions and I believe one is 1/4" or maybe 3/8" longer than the other. I stole some pics of them from CC Specialties. I honestly don't know if the length makes any difference but it sounds like you're using the long version. (Also, if you're using the long version it's probably really hard to get at the slot to make any adjustment).

Also, I don't understand how it could be tight in the center but have play when at either end of rotation. Something just doesn't seem right for it to be that way.

Here's the long version IH-62806-C2

And here's the short version IH-379992-R1

 

[dschwandt]

• Ref:
  6
  IH-379992-R1
  Stud, Cam Follower | (Used w/steering gear IH-384800-R95)
  
  
  
  
  
  
• Ref:
  IH-62806-C2
  STUD | (Used w/steering gear IH-400884-R91)
  This part replaces IH-62806-C1.

 

[hydroharry]

David S - are you giving us the "long and short of it"?

 

[kashaver]

Congratulations! you happen to have a worm shaft not worn as badly as most! That is why it is tighter in the middle (center) than at the ends. It is purposely made that way to compensate for all those little back and forth turns of the steering wheel to just keep the tractor going straight. It wears more at the middle so its intentionally made looser at the ends so you can adjust the wear back out of it and it won't bind up on the ends of the worm in tight turns.

I learned this back in the day when I was studying automotive machanics.

 

[danderson]

That’s why the manual say to adjust the follower when the gear is centered. It’s a little tighter there.

 

[John DeBree]

The stud I bought looks more like the long one. I didn't compare it to the old one. As I said, it works fine, although it's backed out nearly all the way. There's a guy that sells them on ebay for $14 with a new set of ball bearings.

 

[dfrisk]

If you stop and think of the geometry involved in the steering gearbox, it's simple to realize why the steering is tighter in the center compared to at the ends of the range. The stud is tapered, the groove it follows is tapered. The steering arm pivots in a single plane that intersects the edge of the circle of the steering worm. As the worm turns, the stud moves up or down the worm and moves across the axis of the steering shaft, moving the stud shallower in the groove where the groove is wider, loosening the steering.

Over the years I've had TONS of fun with CC steering gearboxes. I had to modify the gearbox on my #72 years ago, as you turned the steering wheel back & forth the steering wheel and worm shaft raised up out of the tube and back down. When it moved an INCH, I figured I had to investigate. The top thrust bearing had pushed through the top ledge molded in the inside of the gearbox that the formed steel washer or thrust bearing race was to sit on. At prior purchasing job I bought a steel part from steel tubing 1-1/2" OD by 3/4" ID about 3/4" long with the ID chamfered. Luckily I had a couple pieces machined but before heat treat, we hardened them to 50-60 Rockwell C. Since my piece was still soft, I could drill and tap #12-24 threads in 3-4 places locking the washer in place supporting the thrust washer. The steering wheel & shaft no longer raised up out of the tube when I turned the wheels the one way. I was able to get an additional 12-15 years of use out of that gearbox, but eventually the steering got loose again. I bit the bullet for a new $125 steering gearbox! The years of use wore under the heat treated material in the worm of the shaft.

 

[Rgausman]

If you think about it, you want no play in the steering while going straight. If there is slop, you would wandering back and forth going down the road.

Many years ago, drove an old Hough loader down the highway with worn out tie rod ends. It went in all directions but straight.

 

[hydroharry]

Yes, having no play would be ideal, but I don't think I've ever come across a Cub Cadet that didn't have some play. Best I could adjust boxes I rebuilt was usually down to about 1/2" total play (1/4" side to side). They all started with about 4-5" total play caused by the steering box and tie rods, and you're right that you really can't drive them straight.

 

[John DeBree]

When I was test-driving my Model 70 Hi-Crop project, it was a chore to keep it going straight. There was a lot of slop in the steering box (I put new rod ends on the drag link and tie rod). When I took it apart, I found out that the follower stud wasn't even tight! The nut had backed off. There was a lot of end play in the steering shaft as well. The stud has a lot of wear, too, which is why I bought a new one. I think it's going to track a lot better now.

 

[mpatterson]

This normal looking for a 982?
I could turn the steering wheel almost 1/2 turn before wheels would move.... I know that part isn't normal, but I didn't think these were chewed up that bad?
Correct part number for the thrust bearings for on the side with the nut and one for the top end of steering tube???
Like to check locally here before ordering from sponsors.
Sorry Digger, like to give ya business, but those are pretty cheap parts to play around with border and shipping if don't need to.

 

[hydroharry]

Hard to tell about the worm gear wear looking at your pics on my phone. Can't tell if it's grease or wear, but I just don't like the looks. As for getting stuff from Charlie, heck you could just drive there since your both in the frozen tundra

 

[mgonitzke]

The surface spalling is pretty common since the hardened outer surface is pretty thin. I'd dress it up smooth with a fine grinding wheel and run it.

 

[mpatterson]

What about the pin, take some time and regrind it smooth at the end and just crank it in another turn if needed when reassembling it?

Anyone happen to have part numbers or bearing numbers for the upgrade kit for the thrust bearings?