Archive through March 14, 2012

[dpbauer]

I'm looking for a way to remove the amount of play in my Control Cam and Swashplate. My 125 Cam has 1/4" play side to side and the pin that rides in the Cam groove binds. Could it be the Pivot Pin is grooved, or loose or ???? Any ideas? danWI

 

[bjamison]

Quick Quiteline question. Are the side panels required for these tractors to operate, or are they there for noise vs airflow?

Reason I ask is that once I get my 1650 going, I may need to temporarily use/store it at a camp that belongs to my Dad until he gets another tractor up there. The place ain't exactly the most secure and (I know this stupid) the only IH/Cub Cadet logo's left on this tractor are on the side shields. I'm think (again I know this sounds so stupid) if I leave the side panels at home, at least a potential thief might not associate the tractor as an IH.

Thanks!
Bill

 

[dtanner]

Dan Bauer

Are you talking about side to side play in the trunnion end?? I need more info to help you . pictures are always best .

Bill Jamison

I have read on here that the side panels help with cooling and noise. This time of year when the weather is cool I don`t think you could hurt the engine running it not pulling .I think they look terrible without the side panels installed.

Where is Denny ??? wow I used to love his long posts

Al thought Hydro Harry is trying to fill that void

 

[dross]

Bill, Don, The side panels are for noise. Theres no cooling air moveing between the side panels and the engine. QL can be run just fine without the panels.

 

[nbartee]

Does anyone know where I can get this thrust bearing mentioned in Cubfaq # 18a?

 

[kmcconaughey]

Norm, do you mean the "NICE 605" bearing? Kirk Engines, Inc. (link at top of the page) sells a kit that includes the bearing, shim washer and low profile Ny-Lock nut for $12.00 + $4.00 shipping. Some of the other forum sponsors might also sell the kits and/or parts for this.

 

[hydroharry]

Bill, Don and Dave - hmm, I sure lean toward the info Don provided for Quiet Line side panels. Although we have not had an IH design engineer confirm this, there has been discussion in the past that the side panels do provide for some change to the air flow and assist in the cooling. Having the side panels installed on the tractor in conjunction with what the parts book calls the Heat Deflector Assy (wavy piece of metal the gas tank appears to sit on), and the Heat Baffle Seal (rubber seal around the Heat Deflector), and the half moon shaped Foam Gasket (on the bottom of the Heat Deflector in the shape of the upper part of the flywheel screen) - somewhat limits the air going to the flywheel to come from underneath the tractor (and we all know air closer to the ground is cooler air). Without the side panels installed the air pulled into the flywheel can come from the sides of the tractor which can include the exhaust flowing out the front and streaming along the sides before rising up since it is hotter than surrounding air, especially when the tractor is moving in a forward motion. So it would seem the intention here by IH is that the air to the engine comes from underneath the tractor. Is there any harm to the engine by running without the side panels? Well, there is a chance the air flowing around the engine and across cooling fins and head, will be hotter and not cool the engine as much. There is also hole cut into the flywheel shroud with a rubber tube that connects to the otherwise sealed air cleaner - so without the side panels the air going to the air cleaner and carb into the engine will be hotter and the engine may not run as well. All in all I believe having the side panels installed provides "some" additional cooling but I don't know how much. Maybe we could enlist the services of someone like Dave Kirk who has a temp gauge on his 1250, to run his tractor with and without the side panels and let us know if there is any difference in engine run temp. Wouldn't be real scientific but I don't know anyone with access to a wind tunnel and that color stuff you can put in the air to see how air flows.

So, Bill, take some good pics of your 1650, especially the serial no. tag, make sure you have good full coverage insurance, and then keep the side panels at home, and while you're at it you could keep the coil to spark plug wire in a hidden location at the camp in case someone tries to use a small screwdriver in the key switch (which in my experience can work to start the tractor).

Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (but people are known to move them to resting places unknown to their owners)

 

[dfrisk]

DON - I'm here. I traded my "unlimited Internet access" for the great new 4G speed several months ago. It's actually quite a bit slower than my old 3G was, but it does boot me off-line several times a day, times out most times I hit enter just before it boots me, but other than that it costs me TWICE as much every month.... So That's why I don't post those long-winded posts anymore.

 

[dfrisk]

HARRY - I'm going to tend to agree with Dave R., that the side panels were more for noise than cooling. The side panels may not hinder cooling but I don't really think they improve cooling.

I mowed the first time last spring with my 982 with the side panels off, and the dry leaves & dust left from the fall & winter made an absolute MESS of the engine. I put a double-layer of aluminum mesh under the frame years ago to keep debris from getting sucked up into the cooling blower and the blower sucks up all kinds of junk from the deck. I can actually tell when the screen gets blocked because I can feel air getting sucked in by the hydro speed control lever.

The old NF GD's seem to keep the cooling air inlet about as clean as any model CC. Without the side panels I suspect a slight breeze pulls as much or more heat away from a hard working Kohler in a CC as any amount of air that may be moving around an AQS style engine in a Q/L.

Talking about Kohler engine rebuilt parts earlier, I just saw on another forum that STENS is discontinuing Kohler K-series rebuild parts, not sure exactly what yet, may only be standard sized pistons & rings, might be all parts, don't know for sure. But like you said, I'd use OEM Kohler parts for a working tractor, piston, rings, rod, especially the head gasket. They cost a little more but I've never had a problem with them on all the engines I've rebuilt. The one thing I wish Kohler would do is include the one-piece cast iron oil control ring in their replacement ring sets, the one that goes in the bottom ring grove as opposed to the two thin scraper rings with the separate expander, I think the cast 1-pc ring does a WHOLE bunch better job at controlling oil. But I know why they don't, it's always about the money!

 

[kmcconaughey]

From a 1975 Quiet Line Brochure:

From a 1976 Quiet Line Brochure:

 

[kfreeman]

So, are the side panels part of the "special air-ducting system"?

 

[hydroharry]

Kraig - Oh Great One Keeper of the Photos - thanks for providing the brochure info. Just what I needed.

Well Dennis - I tend to agree with IH per the brochure info Kraig posted, and basically supports what I said earlier.

Ken - yes, the side panels are part of the air ducting, per se, since they limit where the air can come from.

Additionally, I don't have my parts book in front of me, but there is a steel plate frame cover on the underside of the frame that extends from the engine shroud back to where the steering box protrudes below the level of the frame, and then just a little more farther back. I don't know the official name of this part, but it's often missing or left off QL tractors, and xx8/xx9 units. It generally helps to keep grass and other debris from being pulled up into the flywheel. Dennis, I don't know if there is something like this on a 982 but would think your mention of a screen is supposed to do something similar. It is another important but often missing item from these tractors.

Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (but sometimes their air flow gets mixed up)

 

[bjamison]

Kraig - that brochure makes a compelling argument to trade the old 169 in for a 1650...

JUST KIDDING!!!!!!!!

Thanks for the info!

Bill

 

[hydroharry]

Kraig - Oh Great One Keeper of the Photos - on a less quieter (pre-QL tractor) note, I'm at a loss to understand one comment in the 1975 brochure you posted below, where it states
More Powerful
The new top of the line model is the most powerful Cub Cadet ever. It has a big 16hp engine hidden beneath all that sound baffling.

What the heck???? Were the 16 horses in the model 169 less powerful than the 16 horses in the model 1650???? I don't know if the torque curve is different between a Kohler K341AQS and an K341A but I wouldn't think so. Maybe it's just the 169 horses are a little older and slower - but that just can't be!!!!!! In fact, I don't have my reference handy, but I'm fairly certain the IH spec sheet calls out higher max rpm for the K341A over the K341AQS so the 169 may technically have more useful hp and/or torque than the 1650!!!!!

Bill - you better trade-in your 1650 for a 169.

Hydro Harry
Old Cubs Never Die (and hp is hp)

 

[kmcconaughey]

Hydro, my guess on the horsepower, the 1975 QL brochure was in the works before the 169 was released.

 

[kmcconaughey]

I believe that pan was on the 1x9 series as well.

 

[kmcconaughey]

Yep,

 

[dtanner]

I did not get along as far as I had wanted today.But I just have to add oil now and install the breather and a few controls.

 

[kmcconaughey]

Don, looking good!

 

[dfrisk]

KRAIG - I don't know why IH decided to form that trough in the lower frame cover. I still have the one I made for mu 129 CC, the K301 had the same style oil pan as a K321 has, and I made mine from a flat piece of stainless steel sheet.

Seems like a good place for dust/dirt to accumulate.