By Owen Carr (Ocarr) The 42' deck pan for my Model 124, narrow frame has rusted beyond repair. Have not been able to find a replacement in good condition. Have come to conclusion that i must build a new one. Am thinking fiberglas laid up over wooden mold. Moving parts on old deck are good, will cannibalize. HOWEVER-A friend is dubious about fiberglas "because of vibration". I don't have that much experience w/fiberglas. Does anyone have experience enuf to advise me? I'm thinking 1/4" or 3/8" thk.? Cud stress areas (mount, spindle & sheave attach points) be reinforced somehow? Maybe with stn.stl.sheet? I'm "handy" & have a full home workshop. But sold my welder otherwise wud attempt to weld one up. Thanks for any info.
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Archive through April 08, 2011
- Thread starter ocarr
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mgwin
Well-known member
OK guys, finally got some pics of my road trip yesterday evening. This is a 64' model(a very good year, I might add). The seat was the first thing to go.
While at it, I shot one of my new cub shack which is getting pretty full along with my basement!
Speaking of trips, I made a short one this evening to look at a 1951 IH pickup. It needs some bodywork, but is in pretty good shape for it's age. Got owner down to 1K for the price. Any suggestions or advice?
While at it, I shot one of my new cub shack which is getting pretty full along with my basement!
Speaking of trips, I made a short one this evening to look at a 1951 IH pickup. It needs some bodywork, but is in pretty good shape for it's age. Got owner down to 1K for the price. Any suggestions or advice?
Tom Hill
IH Cub Cadets were built when it had to last some time. I bet a good drive cup and a hose clamp and the abuse it was given , you could and do get a few more years ,then it should be worn out. its not hard to look and find things you could change and for who
IH Cub Cadets were built when it had to last some time. I bet a good drive cup and a hose clamp and the abuse it was given , you could and do get a few more years ,then it should be worn out. its not hard to look and find things you could change and for who
Owen,
Interesting idea. Composites hold up well in areas of vibration, that’s why they use it in aircraft. 3/8” thick seems about right, and I would definitely reinforce all attach areas with SS encapsulated in the fiberglass. You must make sure the SS is very clean & abraded. I assume you’re talking about a wet layup using a polyester base resin? You could also make your mold from the old deck using the same method, wet layup. Then smooth up your pattern and apply a good release agent. I’ll have to give this more thought, may come up with some more ideas.
Interesting idea. Composites hold up well in areas of vibration, that’s why they use it in aircraft. 3/8” thick seems about right, and I would definitely reinforce all attach areas with SS encapsulated in the fiberglass. You must make sure the SS is very clean & abraded. I assume you’re talking about a wet layup using a polyester base resin? You could also make your mold from the old deck using the same method, wet layup. Then smooth up your pattern and apply a good release agent. I’ll have to give this more thought, may come up with some more ideas.
mgwin
Well-known member
Wayne,
You guessed it! Got to looking at the map and found out I bought a 100 last year in Locust, which is about 7 miles east of Midland! There must have been a patch of them sprouting in that area.
Donald,
You've got so many cubs if you sold four or five, you wouldn't even miss them!
You guessed it! Got to looking at the map and found out I bought a 100 last year in Locust, which is about 7 miles east of Midland! There must have been a patch of them sprouting in that area.
Donald,
You've got so many cubs if you sold four or five, you wouldn't even miss them!
Wonderful truck. We have a 55 IH that is like a battleship. Got hit by a mustang car once with it and I had to look for damage, while, literally, the car was markedly damaged. My nephew is currently in the restoration of it after sitting for quite a few years. Learned to drive in that truck and love it for it's hard work for our family.
Charlie`s
running cards now and Keeping this site going. Good stuff, keeps us all going.
Owen Carr
(A friend is dubious about fiberglas "because of vibration".)
Don`t be , fiberglass is more flexible than steel and still will not stress crack and break. Ge they make blades for amputees to run on that don`t break. A mower deck is a simple thing to do . It does have stress points That can be over come . PM me and I will tell you how , and what you must do to to make it work.
running cards now and Keeping this site going. Good stuff, keeps us all going.
Owen Carr
(A friend is dubious about fiberglas "because of vibration".)
Don`t be , fiberglass is more flexible than steel and still will not stress crack and break. Ge they make blades for amputees to run on that don`t break. A mower deck is a simple thing to do . It does have stress points That can be over come . PM me and I will tell you how , and what you must do to to make it work.
Owen, as an advanced composite engineer with the US Navy I would strongly recommend that you do NOT attempt this. Yes it can be done but here are the issues you will have to address;
1. Abrasion erosion: The very sand/dirt in the soil will act like a snadblaster/grinder and erode the resin away from the fiber losing structural integrety.
2. Projectiles: Unless we are talking ballastic composites (kevlar/boron and the like) the reason for a steel deck is to stop projectiles.
3. Mounting points: Mounting spindles in composites will require you to embed steel into the fiberglass layup. Joining any stress loaded metal into composites is an engineering issue.
4. Static electricity: This is something you must think about as metal blades spinning around a FG deck create an electric charge. You cannot ground FG decks; they are insulators.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents.
1. Abrasion erosion: The very sand/dirt in the soil will act like a snadblaster/grinder and erode the resin away from the fiber losing structural integrety.
2. Projectiles: Unless we are talking ballastic composites (kevlar/boron and the like) the reason for a steel deck is to stop projectiles.
3. Mounting points: Mounting spindles in composites will require you to embed steel into the fiberglass layup. Joining any stress loaded metal into composites is an engineering issue.
4. Static electricity: This is something you must think about as metal blades spinning around a FG deck create an electric charge. You cannot ground FG decks; they are insulators.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents.
Norm, The majority of aircraft are made from aluminum not composite. The composites used are not for strength as much as for weight. They rely heavily on epoxy toughened resins infused into carbon fiber over aluminum or nomex honeycomb celled coring.
Don, The last thing you want in a mower deck is flexibility. Cyclic vibration leads to fatique failure of the material. Mild steel usd in decks is much better suited for this application. A truely good deck would be build from cast aluminum (remember lawnboy push mowers). Light still erosion and projectile resistant. The actual test for a mower deck is to drive it over a pile of nails to see if any get out, how far they travel, and in what direction. Wouldn't want to be the test engineer for that one.
Also leg prosthetics are made from carbon fiber/epoxy in order to save weight. They have very little load on them (coouple of hundred pounds) are engineered to flex like a naturally occuring ankle, and are usually fitted with Titainium or stainless steel fittings and shock absorbers.
I'll climb off my soapbox now.
Don, The last thing you want in a mower deck is flexibility. Cyclic vibration leads to fatique failure of the material. Mild steel usd in decks is much better suited for this application. A truely good deck would be build from cast aluminum (remember lawnboy push mowers). Light still erosion and projectile resistant. The actual test for a mower deck is to drive it over a pile of nails to see if any get out, how far they travel, and in what direction. Wouldn't want to be the test engineer for that one.
Also leg prosthetics are made from carbon fiber/epoxy in order to save weight. They have very little load on them (coouple of hundred pounds) are engineered to flex like a naturally occuring ankle, and are usually fitted with Titainium or stainless steel fittings and shock absorbers.
I'll climb off my soapbox now.
Robert Klein
I worked here for 20 + years. and we made abrasive resistant pipe. have a read here http://www.reinforcedplasticsystems.com/
I worked here for 20 + years. and we made abrasive resistant pipe. have a read here http://www.reinforcedplasticsystems.com/
Robert K.,
Those are all good points you bring up and I agree an aluminum deck would be ideal. Composites have been used in aircraft for strength, weight reduction, and corrosion resistance for over 60 years and only the newer composites incorporate the carbon fibre technology. I’ve been in this industry for half of it.
Owen,
It would be better to obtain a good steel deck even if you had to have it shipped. I think there are plenty of used decks out there. Can you adapt a 44? The time & money you would spend fabricating a fiberglass deck and resolving some of the issues that Robert brought up would more than offset the costs.
Those are all good points you bring up and I agree an aluminum deck would be ideal. Composites have been used in aircraft for strength, weight reduction, and corrosion resistance for over 60 years and only the newer composites incorporate the carbon fibre technology. I’ve been in this industry for half of it.
Owen,
It would be better to obtain a good steel deck even if you had to have it shipped. I think there are plenty of used decks out there. Can you adapt a 44? The time & money you would spend fabricating a fiberglass deck and resolving some of the issues that Robert brought up would more than offset the costs.
Dale,
I had a 72’ IH Travelall once and came away with an appreciation of how IH stuff was made. It was massive. I bought it because I needed something to pull our travel trailer and a neighbor had this for sale. I built the 26’ trailer so it was heavier than a factory one but it pulled the trailer up slumgullion pass in Colorado like it wasn’t even there.
I had to replace the “A” frame bushings in its torsion bar suspension one time. That was a job. I always said that the main tools for working on an International was a sledgehammer and a torch. I thought I was never going to get those bars out!
I had a 72’ IH Travelall once and came away with an appreciation of how IH stuff was made. It was massive. I bought it because I needed something to pull our travel trailer and a neighbor had this for sale. I built the 26’ trailer so it was heavier than a factory one but it pulled the trailer up slumgullion pass in Colorado like it wasn’t even there.
I had to replace the “A” frame bushings in its torsion bar suspension one time. That was a job. I always said that the main tools for working on an International was a sledgehammer and a torch. I thought I was never going to get those bars out!
Don, I appreciate the link but we're are comparing apples and oranges. I regularly cut through such pipe with an abrasive blaster (non-waterjet). There's a reason sand blast nozzles are made from ceramic, and even they wear out. I'm in RI where the soil is mostly sand. I've worn through 3/8" thk steel mover blades just by the sand eroding the top bended edge.
Fiberglass decks have been tried in the lawn industry. None have passed the standard safety tests.
The American National Standards Institute (ANSI) has issued ANSI B71.1, Walk-Behind Mowers and Ride-On Machines with Mowers - Safety Standards. This ANSI standard was developed by engineers within the lawnmower industry and most manufacturers adhere to this standard. If a mower has been certified by an independent testing facility to comply with ANSI B71.1, the mower will carry a decal from the Outdoor Power Equipment Institute (OPEI) certifying compliance.
The United States Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) has also issued regulations for walk-behind lawn mowers. Unlike the ANSI consensus standard, the CPSC regulations are not optional; manufacturers are required to comply. Some of the important features of the ANSI standard and CPSC regulations are listed below.
Fiberglass decks have been tried in the lawn industry. None have passed the standard safety tests.
The American National Standards Institute (ANSI) has issued ANSI B71.1, Walk-Behind Mowers and Ride-On Machines with Mowers - Safety Standards. This ANSI standard was developed by engineers within the lawnmower industry and most manufacturers adhere to this standard. If a mower has been certified by an independent testing facility to comply with ANSI B71.1, the mower will carry a decal from the Outdoor Power Equipment Institute (OPEI) certifying compliance.
The United States Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC) has also issued regulations for walk-behind lawn mowers. Unlike the ANSI consensus standard, the CPSC regulations are not optional; manufacturers are required to comply. Some of the important features of the ANSI standard and CPSC regulations are listed below.
THIS IS NOT AN AD!
Owen, There's a garden tractor junkyard not far from you. Give them a call!
ACRES OF MOWERS FOR PARTS PLUS MORE IN BUS FOR MTD,JOHNDEERE,CUB CADET,SEARS,WHEELHORSE,AND MORE. TIRES,WHEELS,DECKS,TRANSMISSIONS,MOTORS,HOODS AND MORE..CALL 540-825-2686 OR 540-729-3422.
Owen, There's a garden tractor junkyard not far from you. Give them a call!
ACRES OF MOWERS FOR PARTS PLUS MORE IN BUS FOR MTD,JOHNDEERE,CUB CADET,SEARS,WHEELHORSE,AND MORE. TIRES,WHEELS,DECKS,TRANSMISSIONS,MOTORS,HOODS AND MORE..CALL 540-825-2686 OR 540-729-3422.
mpatterson
Well-known member
Charged up the battery on the 982 last night and put it in today to start up for the first time this year. Its been sitting all winter as usual. I am running into the same issue as I did sometime last year, not sure if the starter is dirty or has a flat spot on it? The engine will start to crank (2 or 3 turns) and then just stop. I can switch the key off and do it again and the same thing. Its not that the engine is locked up or anything. Just seems like there isn't enough juice to crank it over. Is it possible the battery is just getting old and it won't crank it over? Eventhough it says its fully charged when hooked up to a 2 year old charger? I was thinking maybe I need to pull the engine and take off the starter and clean it up? I notice the bendix doesn't completely return to the rest position when disengaged. It clears the flywheel, but that's it. Is the spring dirty or worn out? If I look down between the shroud and the engine block it doesn't look too bad, some dust caked around the shroud - but maybe that's enough to do it? Where the heck is the ground to the frame on these? I see where its grounded at the battery, then there is a small black wire that comes out of the harness just under the gas tank. Its the same section of the harness that the positive wire goes to the end of the starter. Do I have to pull the motor in order to see the ground? Is it possible that I tightened the clutch up too much on the front of the engine that is causing too much drag? I am off to get a feeler gauge and block and tackle, just incase I need to pull the engine. I definately need to recheck the clutch anyway, so I need to pick up the feeler gauges from the old man. Any suggestions??
By the way, its an Onan 19.5hp in this. I can turn the output shaft of the motor fine with my hand so like I said before, nothing is locked up or siezed.
Any suggestions or thoughts would be great. The service manual doesn't have any trouble shooting things in it except for the electric clutch.
By the way, its an Onan 19.5hp in this. I can turn the output shaft of the motor fine with my hand so like I said before, nothing is locked up or siezed.
Any suggestions or thoughts would be great. The service manual doesn't have any trouble shooting things in it except for the electric clutch.
